Don't use your race as an excuse!!!

[BrassFusion]

Soon enough, there won't be any black or white people, you know? That's where racial sensitivity gets confusing- with those of mixed race. Um, it's hard enough having special regard for black people (I don't), so why should everyone walk on eggshells around people who are 1/8th black, 1/16th Native American, or 1/32 Mongolian?

We should be teaching our kids to ignore race and embrace culture instead, because the two can and should be independent.

[wheresmypiggy]

And here's a question in all honesty...do I look "Mexican" to you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

One word. Hedgehog.

But honestly....

In response to several notes without having to go back quoting cause i'm lazy (sorry).

I did not go to Grant. I went to Adams elementary. I will say this, money had alot to do with the racial problems.

I was the stereotypical black kid to them.

I was poor. My hair always a mess. I looked straight outta the Jackson 5. Came from a single parent home. You all know the story. Kids who came from better homes and better money happened to be white and were raised racist in my area.

I'm not saying other kids did not have problems. I'm saying mine were caused by race.

The reason I believe that I do deserve help as an adult because of my race is this...

For 12 years in school whenever I took a test where I had to fill out my ethnicity I circled other or white. I believed I was white. I grew up with a white mother and brother in a white neighborhood. I never knew my father. I had alot darker skin then but I still believed I was white.

The teachers would erase my little circle and fill in black. The more minorities they had in their schools. The more money they got. You know what I got in return? Nothing. They tried to hold me back saying I was stupid and was unable to learn at the same level as other students.

Teachers would call my mother in and tell her that they did not approve of interacial children and that they did not know if they could help me but they would "do their best". Funny part was... I was smarter then most of the kids in all of my classes. But because of my race, teachers wanted to hold me back. Smother my intelligece.

You have to remember that these teachers were in their 50's then. They grew up old school. These kids parents were taught they ways of their parents.

It was all inbred hatred.

Sure when I got into h.s I finally met other black kids but guess what? I was too white for them. I was shunned by both groups.

By the time I reached 11th grade race no longer made a difference in school except for a few kids who were obviously racist.

When I graduated I did get the grants and scholarships for being a minority and some for withstanding racial hardships (those were privately funded scholarships).

My sisters life is not a sign of the times changing. Most of her friends don't like the other black kids. I have even caught her saying things like " i don't like that black girl" I ask why and she has no answer.

My sisters easy walk in life is because she has blond hair and blue eyes. Its just a constant reminder that if I had looked different things would have been different.

And yes I know that holds true for anyone who looks different. I understand being beat up for looking weird, h.s brought alot of that for me because I wore all black.

But my point is this. Race is a problem. I know I don't look black to most of you. In fact the snow white comment still rings in my head. But to someone who truly hates the other races its obvious.

Here is something else to ponder.

I applied originally to U of D mercy. I had an extremely high grade point average and had all my pre reqs for my course study.

I was denied because they reached their needed quota for minorities. I still have my rejection notice. I cried for days.

And saying you're irish and thats the reason you drink is silly. I agree it is a culture thing. But I don't see being irish as being a race. Race is commonly understood as the color of your skin. I know that is not the definiton but that is what majority of society goes by.

And to let anyone worried know... I'm not offended by anything in this thread. Its all a matter of each ones own opinion.

Until the ACLU and the government and affirmitive action decide that race is not an issue, I will still stand behind my opinion that it is and I do deserve a little bit of help. The poor get help. Why cant the minorities?

[phee]

Do you believe that anyone who was treated unfairly for ANY REASON deserves more attention and help? Or only if it is racially oriented?

[wheresmypiggy]

Anyone deserves a little extra help.

Thats why I volunteer my time.

Unfortunately race is one of the biggest issues and one of the most violent and hurtful throughout your whole life. I still suffer from it.

But thats why I made note of the scholarships I had received, I should have mentioned more of them. There were scholarships that I also received for overcoming adversity as well.

The help is out there for anyone. Sure I could get back into school with other scholarships and grants but it would not be anywhere near what I had before.

Bush sr says i'm black. Bush jr says i'm white. Thats politics.

Being with held from schools because of being a minority, being rejected at a job because i'm a minority, being shunned from a church because i'm a minority.

I've worked with learning disabled kids, i've worked in counseling groups for minorities and worked in adversity groups. I do what I can to help who I can. I give more than I have all the time. I believe anyone who wants and needs help deserves it.

I hate it when basic needs an principals are afforded to some and denied to others. I try to help even out the playing field.

I'm not one of those black people who cries and complains about how my ancestors were oppressed. But I do cry out against they way myself and other children/adults are oppressed in society today. And face it. Alot of it, majority of it still has to do with race.

Race does not give me an excuse to knock over a liquor store.

Race was a reason to arrest me on charges of vandalism and theft because I fit the profile of a black female suspect. I was held for over 7 hrs, molested, denied a phone call and made fun of. 7 hrs. They let me go with no explanation. No charges. Denied my ever being there. Some nice good ol' boys they were.

Race is a problem in my every day life. My grants and scholarships were not paid for out of your taxes, my acceptance into college did not stop someone smarter than me from getting in as well. So why is it pathetic as hh said to use race to my advantage wich in essence really boils down to an excuse if you dont see race as an issue?

[wheresmypiggy]

  And he is very dark.  You don't really look black to me.  I am not saying you aren't, I am just saying I find it odd that people would go out of their way to call you the "n" word when I wouldn't even know you were black if you didn't tell me. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I will say this. Because I am so light it offends alot more people than someone who was darker would.

There are still alot of people out there who are very morally against interracial children because now when I have kids they will be mixed/dirty as they call it. And what if my kid decides he/she wants to have mixed kids. Lots of people see it as interracial children dirty up the mixing pool.

[BrassFusion]

If your scholarships didn't come from our tax dollars, where did they come from? The tooth fairy?

As for you getting rejected from U of D mercy JUST because of your race, yeah right. Would you have made it if they were looking to fill a quota? Possibly.

Your candyland welfare system is pretty naive. "Oh, I should get this assistance, but so should everyone else." The whole POINT of welfare and assistance is that some people need a leg up and others do not. The system is funded by those who are "well off" or whatever.

I will be damned if I'm going to willingly hand over money to fund scholarships to rich kids because they're black and I'm white. I got a scholarship based on merit, not race, and if they want it they should get a high GPA or SAT score too. If they can't, then that means they're not necessarily as qualified to attend college, doesn't it?

Judge people not by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character, I guess I'm trying to say.

[Steven]

I will say this. Because I am so light it offends alot more people than someone who was darker would.

There are still alot of people out there who are very morally against interracial children because now when I have kids they will be mixed/dirty as they call it. And what if my kid decides he/she wants to have mixed kids. Lots of people see it as interracial children dirty up the mixing pool.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

there is alot of truth to this statement.

and beleive me its even worse if your a hedgehog. thats a terrible way to grow up, quick somebody make me a sandwich....

[phee]

If a person is born with dark skin but has monitary resources, should they get extra help in the same way that a poor person whom happens to be caucasion does?

Or should only the person with more skin pigmentation get the help despite the lighter skinned person needing to get helped?

In other words... does the color of your skin alone determine what kind of treatment as far as government funding that you are entitled too?

[Steven]

Soon enough, there won't be any black or white people, you know? That's where racial sensitivity gets confusing- with those of mixed race. Um, it's hard enough having special regard for black people (I don't), so why should everyone walk on eggshells around people who are 1/8th black, 1/16th Native American, or 1/32 Mongolian?

We should be teaching our kids to ignore race and embrace culture instead, because the two can and should be independent.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

pretty soon?

um......I sorta think not but I like your idealism. People in general seem to want to seperate and segregate themselves into individual boxes.......technically were a bit better off but the social trends of isolationism don't seem to lend themselves to that ideal....at least not in my line of thinking, as this is not a world where everybody's huggin up......

also - and this may offend but whatafuckka - I beleive that white people statistically recognize X and Y - but lack some basic foundational understanding on how a minority remains a minority because hey - your white. You mean well....but you will always be white - your expereinces will always be second hand. Certain things will fomulaicly seem quite logical, but logic really has little to do with racism and segregation and general distrust among people....fear rules that mindset.

As for the thing about stepping on eggshells.......well, theres no need for that and again thats a fear based approach is it not? To me Jesi's been a great example of what to do about "it".......get involved. volunteer. give back.

Steven

[The_Dark]

Yes... people with dark skin color get more help from the government. it's built into the system. Affirmative Action is one of the ways...

and um.. If my taxes didn't pay for your scholarships and grants... Where did the money come from?

and until we are mixed as a people to the point that everyone has the same skin color and general facial features.. race will be a factor in everything. It's natural behavior built into our brains. Just like every other animal on the planet.. we prefer animals from our own "pack"

[BrassFusion]

I know you can't hear me, Dark, but speak for yourself. Kthx.

And Steven... who are you to judge white people? In fact, Jesi AND Steven... how are you so sure that white people have it SO much better than you? That's a helluva step backwards, assuming that we're all so much different.

[wheresmypiggy]

I have never implied that white people dont have it just as hard. In fact over and over again I have said I know this can happen to anyone. It just was more in my type of situation.

Also I have noted several times everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

No color should not be the only determining factor on government assistance.

No affirmative action is not stronger for people of a darker complexion.

I'm speaking from my experience not anyone elses.

And my scholarships were privately funded thank you. From sympathetic people who reached intot their own pockets and shelled out their own money.

Not your tax dollars. And if you have a problem with the way your tax dollars are spent. Start up a petition. Stand up for what you believe in instead of just placing blame and resentment and anger.

(Please note: none of this is directed at anyone in particular, these are only answers to asked questions and in no way reflect my opinion of anyone.)

[Brenda Starrr]

Jesi......

After reading all of your posts here, I would just like to point out that you are a really amazing woman.

That is all.

[Steven]

I know you can't hear me, Dark, but speak for yourself. Kthx.

And Steven... who are you to judge white people? In fact, Jesi AND Steven... how are you so sure that white people have it SO much better than you? That's a helluva step backwards, assuming that we're all so much different.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

#1: Holy Moly but I think I made you angry.

#2: Please describe my "judgement" in making a statement that white people cannot grasp at being a minority in all of it's complexities. Simple truthful statement - I never siad white people are A holes and I married me one of them white womenz by the way.

#3: When did i EVER say I was sure that white people had it better than me?

But since we're on the subject Brass, well, obviously I'm a bad ass mofo.

I've been on my own since I was 17.

And I'm a handsome somebich.

And I sing like a mutha in my own rock and roll band.

And there is food in my fridge, including porkchops.

And I've owned two homes in my time.

My job pisses me off sometimes but I pull pretty decent coin and am in charge of a bunch of white people who must answer to me and I am drunk with power.

And I own two cars - both of which are paid in full and one of which is a pukey green metallic color.

I have the discovery channel AND VH1.

Both of my cats know who the Boss is aroound here.

My girl still digs me.

My friends rarely throw me out.

I own shoes.

I have health insurance for both myself and my wife.

No vision plan but the dentist just drilled on me a week ago.

Let's see a white man do all of that.

PS.... any chance you've added a few things of your own to my decalred points of view??? Cause I promise you if I felt a certain way - belevie me I'd say it straight to you, I do not tip toe, I do not insinuate, I do not allude to that which I feel or beleive, therefore If I did not actually say something, then I dont actually feel that way.

Fair Enough?

Steven

PPSS: I likewise do not know what its like to be white. because I'm not (white). just a statement of fact, everybody sleep well......

[Steven]

Jesi......

After reading all of your posts here, I would just like to point out that you are a really amazing woman.

That is all.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Exactly.

[Paper Hearts]

Firstly, I want express that I feel that this thread is retarded. I just feel that people make themselves. I mean it doesn't matter who your parents are or your grandparents or where they came from, we all make ourselves. Your father or mother could have been someone great but that doesn't make you shit and it doesn't mean that you're necessarrily great as well. Whatever stereotypes you want to assign to yourself, like oh we drink a lot or we have bad tempers, go on and believe in that and you'll be exactly that type of person...but it's not because of you didn't have a choice, it's because of your fucking head.

I personally do not buy into any of this stuff that says that a majority person can't fully empathise with a minority person or the other way around because I believe we're all basically the same, I don't think that one group of people has a greater capacity for emotion or reasoning than any other group. It really doesn't take much to figure out, it's just certain people can't understand each other, but not everyone.

I've been to the African American history museum and seen the big photographs of black people being linched by whites at church picnics and read the little placards next to them that tell that the images where actually first printed on popular post-cards that you could buy at your local gas station and I know that some white people suck but I've lived with Puerto Ricans and Mexicans and African Americans and I've met some real assholes all the way around, but I do not feel that stupidity is a matter of race.

[Homicidalheathen]

Very well put M'man.

Firstly, I want express that I feel that this thread is retarded. I just feel that people make themselves. I mean it doesn't matter who your parents are or your grandparents or where they came from, we all make ourselves. Your father or mother could have been someone great but that doesn't make you shit and it doesn't mean that you're necessarrily great as well. Whatever stereotypes you want to assign to yourself, like oh we drink a lot or we have bad tempers, go on and believe in that and you'll be exactly that type of person...but it's not because of you didn't have a choice, it's because of your fucking head.

I personally do not buy into any of this stuff that says that a majority person can't fully empathise with a minority person or the other way around because I believe we're all basically the same, I don't think that one group of people has a greater capacity for emotion or reasoning than any other group. It really doesn't take much to figure out, it's just certain people can't understand each other, but not everyone.

I've been to the African American history museum and seen the big photographs of black people being linched by whites at church picnics and read the little placards next to them that tell that the images where actually first printed on popular post-cards that you could buy at your local gas station and I know that some white people suck but I've lived with Puerto Ricans and Mexicans and African Americans and I've met some real assholes all the way around, but I do not feel that stupidity is a matter of race.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[The_Dark]

Hey Steven... you have owned one more house than me... and my green car is kinda a forrest green... other than that... we are pretty much on the same level... except I'm white.

[torn asunder]

#2:  Please describe my "judgement" in making a statement that white people cannot grasp at being a minority in all of it's complexities.  Simple truthful statement - I never siad white people are A holes and I married me one of them white womenz by the way.

tell that to the white person who grew up in harlem, or chinatown, or any other area where whites were the minority... people - anyone can be a minority, it all depends on your environment.

Let's see a white man do all of that.

sarcasm? honestly can't tell - hope so... :blink =)

and just to clarify, this next bit isn't directed at any one individual...

skin color should never come into play - i don't care if you're black, white, mexican, latino, martian, venutian, etc... the simple act of catagorizing someone separates them from you. it's a divisive act, and it in no way promotes peace and harmony in the world. and before anyone says "that's a nice sentiment, but that's not how the world is", let me say this - how will you ever get where you're going, if you never pick/define your destination? of course we all do catgorize - it's how our minds work. we use labels all the time to store memories, and our minds look for commonalities in things as a method of learning. it's a very hard thing to get away from, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. anyway, think of this - how many people do you think are really of pure, "unadultrated" lineage? how many people, (in the US, anyway) can trace their heritage back to mankinds origins, without finding at least one mixing of "race"? we're all a blend of different ethnicities, and it shouldn't make one whit of difference in how we live, or treat others. i know many of you will tell me that i don't understand, because i look white, and haven't gone through the things you have. fine. you want to play martyr, that's your business, but don't expect others to hand you life on a silver platter. entitlement sucks. you want something, go after it. if people are against you, hold you back, put you down, try harder. laying blame on other people for how "hard" your life has been does nothing to make your life better - it just makes you a victim, and ultimately keeps you from realizing your own value and worth. i have no idea what i am - i was adopted young, and i never bothered to memorize my biological heritage. (i have it at home somewhere, i'm sure...) and why should i? of what benefit is it to me to classify myself one way or another? as far as i'm concerned, i'm everything, and i'm nothing - i'm a bastard american. hell, i don't even know where i'm going with this anymore, so i think i'll stop... :fear

[Paper Hearts]

I remember on the Smurfs, Gargamel threw the blue word around a lot and that wasn't right.

[Steven]

Firstly, I want express that I feel that this thread is retarded.

I personally do not buy into any of this stuff that says that a majority person can't fully empathise with a minority person or the other way around because I believe we're all basically the same, I don't think that one group of people has a greater capacity for emotion or reasoning than any other group. It really doesn't take much to figure out, it's just certain people can't understand each other, but not everyone.

I've met some real assholes all the way around, but I do not feel that stupidity is a matter of race.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

quoted and condensed to focus on a couple of points....

a) amazing how this subject makes people angry.

b) retarded is your point of view, obviously important to you. some of these other points of view likewise, matter to them. What your doing here is basically saying that yours is the only point of view worth anything white man (joke...ok?).

c) I'm not talking about empathy regarding minorities and the like. In fact, I dont need the empathy, and neither do you. I'm simply talking about certain experiences that we share that are uniquely our own due to our culture which yes happens to come from our distinctive nationalities. Here's a cheesy example: I watch George Lopez' standup routine and howl till the tears roll down. Laura, giggles a bit here and there, but there is SO much inside shit that is uniquely Latino that it fly's right past her - she does not get it or recognize it. Is that a sin? Fuck no, she's not Latino - I am. Those same little idiosincrities have a hand in shaping who I am and how I process certain stimuli, how I address people, what I do in stressful situations, etc. Its neither right nor wrong, it simply is what it is. And that was my point. That to argue from a data based or "studied" approach regarding certain types of people and cultures is to miss some very important fly-bys that are difficult to explain to those outside of the experience. Those littel things, can be very important to them - yes, but maybe not so important to you, because those experiences are nto part of a chain of events in the same way that they would be for somone within the culture. I'm not talking about what's in my DNA - I'm talking about what's in my life experience as Steven Urenda versus the life experience of Billy Johnson.

d) I'm applying the same question to you that I asked of Brass......where - is there an insinuation on my part that someone is in a better position, or sombody owes somebody, or somebody has a greater capacity for emotion or reasoning or somebody is a natural dumb ass or??????? Where do I say these things? I dont - because I do not beleive these things.

What I DO say however - is that we come from different backgrounds and expereinces - and every one of them deserves some real consideration and regardless of how smart you are our what resources you've gleaned from.......perhaps a listening ear and a moment to pause can teach you even more.

Unless your too smart for that. Then you dont have to.

Steven

[Steven]

Hey Steven... you have owned one more house than me... and my green car is kinda a forrest green... other than that... we are pretty much on the same level... except I'm white.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Never!!! Get thee beneath me!!!!!!

[DarkVampire]

And to think this started lighthearted at least from my point. :erm

[Steven]

A)  tell that to the white person who grew up in harlem, or chinatown, or any other area where whites were the minority... people - anyone can be a minority, it all depends on your environment.

sarcasm? honestly can't tell - hope so...  :blink  =)

and just to clarify, this next bit isn't directed at any one individual...

B)  skin color should never come into play - i don't care if you're black, white, mexican, latino, martian, venutian, etc... the simple act of catagorizing someone separates them from you. it's a divisive act, and it in no way promotes peace and harmony in the world.

C)  and before anyone says "that's a nice sentiment, but that's not how the world is", let me say this - how will you ever get where you're going, if you never pick/define your destination? of course we all do catgorize - it's how our minds work.

D)  we use labels all the time to store memories, and our minds look for commonalities in things as a method of learning. it's a very hard thing to get away from, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. anyway, think of this - how many people do you think are really of pure, "unadultrated" lineage? how many people, (in the US, anyway) can trace their heritage back to mankinds origins, without finding at least one mixing of "race"? we're all a blend of different ethnicities, and it shouldn't make one whit of difference 

E)  in how we live, or treat others. i know many of you will tell me that i don't understand, because i look white, and haven't gone through the things you have. fine. you want to play martyr, that's your business, but don't expect others to hand you life on a silver platter. entitlement sucks. you want something, go after it.

F)  if people are against you, hold you back, put you down, try harder. laying blame on other people for how "hard" your life has been does nothing to make your life better - it just makes you a victim, and ultimately keeps you from realizing your own value and worth. i have no idea what i am - i was adopted young, and i never bothered to memorize my biological heritage. (i have it at home somewhere, i'm sure...) and why should i? of what benefit is it to me to classify myself one way or another? as far as i'm concerned, i'm everything, and i'm nothing - i'm a bastard american. hell, i don't even know where i'm going with this anymore, so i think i'll stop...  :fear

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

good points, let's see if I can offer something up here....

A) looks like I should not have ever used the word minority in this subject - my mistake, and apparently its misleading in this application. To calrify, see my above noted response to paper hearts to better understand what I'm trying to say....

B) I agree. I also add the statement that categorization is exactly wha the human species does, has always done, and shall always continue to do, even if they bleach us all the same color. we'll use other social castes to work with. Incidently I dont think anyone in here has been condoning that speration - jsut discussing it.

C) Let me answer yrou question with another question:

How will you TRULY plot yoru course to get where youthink you want to go - if you don't first take a mometn to realize exactly where you stand now? There are so many lost people in this world who are trying to plot a course. I offend people from time to time, and I dont take this lightly, but I DO know exactly who I am, and what I am, and why. Mixed in there from time to time is my heritage - and it does not require "pure" bloodlines to make that effect. In fact who cares?

D) Actually I think we use labels soley to create comfort levels. We remember plenty all by the expereinces themselves. We use the labels - to give ourselves permission to be affected in certain ways. But to me - "Mexican-American" is not a label. A word like "Dis Functional or CO Dependent"...now that's a snazzy label.

E) I'm not a martyr - in fact I'm very much still alive and breathing. If I was attempting to utulize a martyr like definition fo myself then I'd be saying "hey -this is it - this is as far as I'll ever go because white man (or whomever or whatever) is holding me down". ANybody who knows me intimately or understands my passions knows that I am nothign liek this nor do I live this way. I am a beaner though.

F) I liked what your saying here. And I agree with it.

ok I'm done.

PS - all that dumb shit I posted before where I said "let's see a white man do that" was a joke that was hopefully and painfully as obvious as it was distastetful. But I bet you chuckled just a wee bit. I know Dark did.....

[Brenda Starrr]

And to think this started lighthearted at least from my point.  :erm

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Shit doesn't stay lighthearted on DGN for long some days. If it gets out of hand, then we have issues. For now, there are a lot of REALLY great viewpoints flying though here.