Don't use your race as an excuse!!!

[torn asunder]

alternatives to a problem that barely exists anymore ...

i think that's a fallacious assumption...

[BrassFusion]

i think that's a fallacious assumption...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe YOU'RE a fallacious assumption...

But in our country, racism is pretty much a boogeyman. People tailor their remarks around their fear of being labeled a racist, despite what their true motives are. It's gotten to witchhunt proportions, and that seems to be working pretty well for us. There are laws in place that ensure SWIFT justice to people in positions of authority who perform overtly racist actions. And for people who aren't in those positions of authority, they can hold their antiquated beliefs, but they aren't taken seriously much of the time.

I'd love to see evidence that my opinion of improving racial harmony in this country is baseless. Well. Not that I'd LOVE to see it, per se, but go for it. Smoke if ya got 'em.

[phee]

Maybe YOU'RE a fallacious assumption...

But in our country, racism is pretty much a boogeyman.

Um.... Do you have any black friends that you have been out with? I do and um... in some areas... yes its fine, but I have seen a lot of it when out and about....

[BrassFusion]

Um.... Do you have any black friends that you have been out with? I do and um... in some areas... yes its fine, but I have seen a lot of it when out and about....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Lessewell my best girlfriend is fresh-off-the-boat filipino. My ex boyfriend is black, we all used to hang out together before he moved to florida. We were the diversity rainbow action squadron or someshit.

I also went to Wayne State, and a lot of my truly formative party situations were in mixed company. I love how everyone on this board assumes I'm so sheltered.

Guys, for crying out loud... race doesn't matter to me. At all. In any situation. Sorry for being insensitive.

[phee]

Lessewell my best girlfriend is fresh-off-the-boat filipino. My ex boyfriend is black, we all used to hang out together before he moved to florida. We were the diversity rainbow action squadron or someshit.

I also went to Wayne State, and a lot of my truly formative party situations were in mixed company. I love how everyone on this board assumes I'm so sheltered.

Guys, for crying out loud... race doesn't matter to me. At all. In any situation. Sorry for being insensitive.

I am glad that you have not had the negative experiences that others have had concerning racism...

[BrassFusion]

I am glad that you have not had the negative experiences that others have had concerning racism...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm the choice of a new generation.

No, seriously.

I've had SOME negative experiences and some borderline (as in, I wonder if those people are staring at us because we're an interracial couple? could be my imagination), but the ones that are really bad are easy to dismiss because I have no respect for the perpatrators, and usually no one else does, either. Again, sorry for being optimistic.

[Paper Hearts]

I think optomism has it's value...for some, but if you really want to make a difference, realism is the ticket.

[torn asunder]

Maybe YOU'RE a fallacious assumption...

personally, i can do without that kind of thing - if you want to debate/discuss my comments, do so on their merit, not on how much of a smart-ass you can be.

But in our country, racism is pretty much a boogeyman. People tailor their remarks around their fear of being labeled a racist, despite what their true motives are. It's gotten to witchhunt proportions, and that seems to be working pretty well for us. There are laws in place that ensure SWIFT justice to people in positions of authority who perform overtly racist actions. And for people who aren't in those positions of authority, they can hold their antiquated beliefs, but they aren't taken seriously much of the time.

I'd love to see evidence that my opinion of improving racial harmony in this country is baseless. Well. Not that I'd LOVE to see it, per se, but go for it. Smoke if ya got 'em.

in no way did i say things weren't improving - what i said was that you thinking the issue of racism was "a problem that barely exists anymore" was incorrect. (perhaps misguided would have been a better word choice) it's still obviously an issue - just because it's not as in-your-face now doesn't mean it doesn't exist, it's more that people have learned to be more subtle with it.

[wheresmypiggy]

I have no problem admitting that things are alot better than they were 40yrs ago or even 10yrs ago.

But I will not admit that racisim is not a problem. I deal with it almost daily. Maybe its the places I choose to hang out at. Or the people I happen to meet. Its there and in my face more often than not.

I'm extremely happy that you don't find race as a problem. I dont either. I find RACISM as a problem.

I give children credit. More than most people. I know of children who can overcome more than any adult. I'm not saying all kids bred out of the KKK clan will stay within their own race. I'm only stating that there are people out there who will always believe in racial segregation.

If the world one day all lives in harmony, thats fucking awesome. But right now we have alot of issues. And racisim is not the boogeyman. Sure I may be afraid of the dark. But i'm also afraid when a group of any race of people walks toward me screaming nigger, or I have rocks thrown at my car (in brighton nonetheless).

I have to watch myself when I travel down south. Its just become second nature to me. I hate the fact that other children have to grow up in fear as well. Regardless of what race.

There are whites who hate blacks, blacks who hate whites, asians who hate blacks, latinos who hate whites... there is and probably will always be segregation amongst the races. And racism will breed out of ignorance.

I wish for racial harmony and harmony amongst the world daily. That would be beautiful. But right now I deal with what I got and I get by however I can.

I could also personally attack anyones views on here if I felt the need. Then back it up with smart ass comments that have no basis or merit. But I choose to not be so ignorant.

Thats a step towards harmony. Not ignorance.

[Paper Hearts]

I think piggy is right about a lot. simply being optomistic is kind of like saying that you don't really care to look at the problem or try and do anything real about it. Being a happy-ass is a bit helpfull but if we look at all our issues like 'it'll be fine', then nothing gets done. It doesn't make you rascist, per-say, although, it just kind of makes you disaffected maybe. I've been white my entire life...but i don't really look at it as Us vs. Them...I look at people being served an injustice and think something has to be done. It's not pessimism, it's realism.

[phee]

I think piggy is right about a lot. simply being optomistic is kind of like saying that you don't really care to look at the problem or try and do anything real about it. Being a happy-ass is a bit helpfull but if we look at all our issues like 'it'll be fine', then nothing gets done. It doesn't make you rascist, per-say, although, it just kind of makes you disaffected maybe. I've been white my entire life...but i don't really look at it as Us vs. Them...I look at people being served an injustice and think something has to be done. It's not pessimism, it's realism.

The term "willfully ignorent" applys when a statement is made such as:

But in our country, racism is pretty much a boogeyman.

[Steven]

I'd love to see evidence that my opinion of improving racial harmony in this country is baseless. Well. Not that I'd LOVE to see it, per se, but go for it. Smoke if ya got 'em.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm too tired today to go back through all of your posts, but I'm assuming the examples you used about certain neighborhoods and suburbia in general becoming much more multi-ethnic.

but that does nto (in my feeble mind) equate to differeing peoples of differing cultures getting togethor and bonding, to me it simply means that they all got a

mortgage that they could afford.

IN fact there are numerous reports (and I hate to use data as backup...its so freaking stale and moldable) that in today's society IN GENERAL - we are more seperated and divided as a people than ever before, and that in the age fo electronic gizmos that make communication so much easier, we actually communicate less. We have LESS friends. Less meaning to our relationships, LESS depth. LESS connection than ever before.

Doesent matter if the White Joneses live across the street from the Black Joneses while they both live kittycorner to the Gomez family.

nobody knows each other anyway.

[phee]

I'm too tired today to go back through all of your posts, but I'm assuming the examples you used about certain neighborhoods and suburbia in general becoming much more multi-ethnic.

but that does nto (in my feeble mind) equate to differeing peoples of differing cultures getting togethor and bonding,  to me it simply means that they all got  a

mortgage that they could afford.

IN fact there are numerous reports (and I hate to use data as backup...its so freaking stale and moldable) that in today's society IN GENERAL - we are more seperated and divided as a people than ever before, and that in the age fo electronic gizmos that make communication so much easier, we actually communicate less.  We have LESS friends.  Less meaning to our relationships, LESS depth. LESS connection than ever before.

Doesent matter if the White Joneses live across the street from the Black Joneses while they both  live kittycorner to the Gomez family.

nobody knows each other anyway.

Good post

[BrassFusion]

I'm too tired today to go back through all of your posts, but I'm assuming the examples you used about certain neighborhoods and suburbia in general becoming much more multi-ethnic.

but that does nto (in my feeble mind) equate to differeing peoples of differing cultures getting togethor and bonding,  to me it simply means that they all got  a

mortgage that they could afford.

IN fact there are numerous reports (and I hate to use data as backup...its so freaking stale and moldable) that in today's society IN GENERAL - we are more seperated and divided as a people than ever before, and that in the age fo electronic gizmos that make communication so much easier, we actually communicate less.  We have LESS friends.  Less meaning to our relationships, LESS depth. LESS connection than ever before.

Doesent matter if the White Joneses live across the street from the Black Joneses while they both  live kittycorner to the Gomez family.

nobody knows each other anyway.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Unverifiable post.

Ok, I know all goths hate TV, and you guys are going to say I'm ignorant for even using it as a source, but check out TV. The few truly racist pundits can't even admit to being racist. Almost everything you see on TV features people of different races coexisting harmoniously. Art imitates life, people!!

I've been in

*counts*

about 4 semi-serious to serious interracial relationships and have gotten virtually no heat for it. I've had friends of a variety of colors and backgrounds who, if they had some serious problem with white people, obviously never aired it.

Based on my own experience, I don't believe those reports of yours, Steven. And all I can do to promote racial harmony I'm already doing. It's not that I don't believe racism doesn't exist at all- that would be stupid. I just discredit those who practice it. I don't care about them because they aren't as human as the rest of us. You could say I'm racist against racists.

[wheresmypiggy]

Based on my own experience,

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Exactly. Your own experiences. Not gathered data. Not just television.

Now. Step back for a second without jumping up and down and realize we are all speaking from our own experiences.

Our own opinions.

Walk a mile in someone elses shoes before you judge. And since you cannot do that. Don't judge. That is left to God.

[Homicidalheathen]

I know this person who is about half Irish like me. He actually thinks its in his genes to drink. I think that is ridiculous. Ok here is why. When I was a bit thinner drinking gave me hypoglycemia.....and....diabetes runs in my family...so you cannot tell me we have a better body for drinking. Also, Native Americans...which I am a tiny part, seem to have taken rather well to drinking....and they did not have alcohol before white man came here. Also, I don't think being Irish makes you crave it more.....or want it more.....or handle it better or whatever. Just don't like people going around saying its basically ok for them to be an alcoholic because they are white or whatever. You know?

[Steven]

Unverifiable post.

Ok, I know all goths hate TV, and you guys are going to say I'm ignorant for even using it as a source, but check out TV. The few truly racist pundits can't even admit to being racist. Almost everything you see on TV features people of different races coexisting harmoniously. Art imitates life, people!!

I've been in

*counts*

about 4 semi-serious to serious interracial relationships and have gotten virtually no heat for it. I've had friends of a variety of colors and backgrounds who, if they had some serious problem with white people, obviously never aired it.

Based on my own experience, I don't believe those reports of yours, Steven. And all I can do to promote racial harmony I'm already doing. It's not that I don't believe racism doesn't exist at all- that would be stupid. I just discredit those who practice it. I don't care about them because they aren't as human as the rest of us. You could say I'm racist against racists.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A) actually, completely verifyable. In fact the free press just did an article on this about a week and a half ago. And I've heard this subject many times recently over the last couple of years mentioned in various forms of media, its a common social problem.

B) but honestly do we need some "verifyable" or laudible resource to decide for us what is painfully obvious? Look, I grew up in total chaos and I can still tell you that in the early 70's people were different, neighbors knew each other, strangers spoke to one another, people wrote letters to one another, couples actually courted, kids rode their bikes outised and played ball all day and never sat infromt of the TV, etc etc etc etc for examples of the numerous things that simply no longer happen anymore. I can pretty much gauranty you Brass - that what I've seen in 40 years is different thatn what you've seen in your lifespan, and I know that pisses you off as if I've declared myself as having some degree of wisdom but this is just the deal: I've watched the regression for more years than you have been alive.

So I'll verify it myself.

Self: is it true homie?

Self: shit yeah it's true, where ya been?

verified.

[phee]

Exactly. Your own experiences. Not gathered data. Not just television.

Now. Step back for a second without jumping up and down and realize we are all speaking from our own experiences.

Our own opinions.

Walk a mile in someone elses shoes before you judge. And since you cannot do that. Don't judge. That is left to God.

This is an awesome post....

I am very VERY white.... I admit it.... and for me to perscribe my own experiences of racism as what "the world" is like is ignorant.... pure and simple.... It would be like someone who doesn't have kids for example, stating how they would react in a crises where they had kids, and then perscribing their behavior on others who actually do have kids.... just doesnt work that way...

[BrassFusion]

You guys are being really sanctimonious. How come y'all are allowed to be right about what the world's like, but I'm clearly WRONG and need to shut up just because I disagree with you?

Phee, you and I are JUST as qualified to form opinions based on our experiences with racism as Piggy is.

[Paper Hearts]

^Succinctly: Some opinions are right.

[phee]

You guys are being really sanctimonious. How come y'all are allowed to be right about what the world's like, but I'm clearly WRONG and need to shut up just because I disagree with you?

Phee, you and I are JUST as qualified to form opinions based on our experiences with racism as Piggy is.

I am not saying you are wrong at all Brass....

What I am saying is, because you don't experience racism or don't see it, doesn't mean that it doesn't exist for others, or that it is a "boogyman" as you put it...

I have seen it when I am out with my not so white friends..... But I don't when I am out with my oh so white friends...

[BrassFusion]

Yeah, well the opinion that "racism will always be around and whitey is to blame, so he needs to fix it" is wrong.

I bet the people following this topic saw one or two things that made them uneasy about my opinion and discarded it as a whole. That ever happen to you, PH?

[BrassFusion]

I am not saying you are wrong at all Brass....

What I am saying is, because you don't experience racism or don't see it, doesn't mean that it doesn't exist for others, or that it is a "boogyman" as you put it...

I have seen it when I am out with my not so white friends..... But I don't when I am out with my oh so white friends...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have experienced racism.

I said that racism is more or less a boogeyman- I guess I should pick my words better around people who tend to latch onto them.

What I meant is that people think there is a whole lot more racism than there really is. What happens when you start to believe that racism exists where it doesn't is that it does start to exist. It's like fairies, where they don't exist if you don't believe in them, that sort of thing...

My point, summed up, in caps because I'm obnoxious.

IF YOU DO NOT BELIEVE THAT RACISM IS HAPPENING AROUND YOU UNLESS YOU HAVE IRREFUTABLE EVIDENCE, IT WILL AFFECT YOUR LIFE EXPONENTIALLY LESS.

Hell. The only time I've gotten pissed off at my students and actually stern with them was when one girl was making fun of a boy for being "yellow." That's the sort of shit that has to stop immediately in my classroom. But that's the only time it's ever happened. The more astute kids notice I'm the only white person in the room, but they don't mean it pejoratively...

[phee]

Yeah, well the opinion that "racism will always be around and whitey is to blame, so he needs to fix it" is wrong.

I bet the people following this topic saw one or two things that made them uneasy about my opinion and discarded it as a whole. That ever happen to you, PH?

I don't hold that opinion that "Whitey" is to blame.... And I am in agreement that affirmative action only makes it worse (thats my opinion)

But I cannot state that it is a problem that is in peoples imaginations or that it is a "boogyman" just because I personally don't experience it on my own...

My Fiance is Native American... So recently... I can see small amounts of it even today

[BrassFusion]

I don't hold that opinion that "Whitey" is to blame.... And I am in agreement that affirmative action only makes it worse (thats my opinion)

But I cannot state that it is a problem that is in peoples imaginations or that it is a "boogyman" just because I personally don't experience it on my own...

My Fiance is Native American... So recently... I can see small amounts of it even today

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Have you ever seen a horse wear pajamas?