deception

[capuchin]

So, as I was walking to class the other day, I was thinking about deception. Mainly, how most people if asked to describe themselves would describe themselves as honest and how most people if asked to describe the trait they dislike most in others, it would be dishonesty.

I don't think positive or negative qualities are static, but are somewhat flexible dependent on the situation. For example, I might consider lying to a boss about being sick but I would never consider lying to my boyfriend. As a result of this flexibility, we've all probably been on both the giving or receiving end of deception at some point in our lives. Which is why we worry about being deceived--because we know how relatively common it is.

But the question is...do you think you can actually tell when you're being deceived?

When I took social behavior, my teacher had us do an exercise in class. She picked four students to tell a story. They had a choice to lie or tell the truth. After hearing each story, she had us write down on a sheet of paper if we thought it was a lie or the truth. Then, she had the volunteers admit whether they had lied or told the truth. Interestingly, most of us were pretty inaccurate in who we judged to be lying or telling the truth, and were basing our judgements on things like how nervous they seemed when telling their story (which could easily have just been a fear of public speaking) or how "honest" their features looked (some people just have "trustworthy" faces).

I guess if it were easy to detect a lie, none of us would ever get deceived.

But I was curious...do you think that you're good at telling when someone is lying to you? If you do, what usually gives it away? Or conversely, what makes you trust other people?

Kinda interested to hear what people think about this...

[torn asunder]

i always accept what someone tells me at face value, (as in, yep, that's what they said) but i never rely on it, and am never surprised if it turns out to be less than truthful. besides, truth is relative anyway... :erm

[TomCat]

If a person looks towards their left, with any hesitation at all, when they are telling you something, they are making shit up, lying, or don't know the correct answer, and are struggling to create an appropriate answer. To the right, with any hesitation, usually is just a sign of hesitation to collect thoughts. It's a great technique. Use it, it works.

[Daevion]

If a person looks towards their left, with any hesitation at all, when they are telling you something, they are making shit up, lying, or don't know the correct answer, and are struggling to create an appropriate answer.  To the right, with any hesitation, usually is just a sign of hesitation to collect thoughts.  It's a great technique. Use it, it works.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

really? how do we know your not making that up?

ok, assuming its correct. Do you mean looking with thier whole head or just thier eyes. Also, what if they are looking at the floor or up in air. Some people don't make eye contact when they talk.

[The Void]

I think it all goes by intuition and personal experience. if you've seen a lot of bullshitters then you know the good and bad ones and the signs and signals, however subtle.

However, there are also great actors and sociopaths among us. That's where intuition comes in, as well as some more experience.

I think some people really can "smell bullshit" even when it's very well hidden or the person thinks they are a master at disguising their lies.

But, this is just my p.o.v.

:grin

[Fierce Critter]

I have an uncanny ability to tell when someone is lying to me. Though sometimes, with certain people, I might put so much faith in them on a regular, walking basis that I might WANT to believe them so much, I'll let doubt creep in and believe what I subconsciously know is BS.

In the end, though, when the truth comes out, I knew I was trusting something I shouldn't have.

I'm not 100%, but I have pretty good instincts/abilities in this area.

[pixiefae]

Body posture is a good indicator. If a person is fidgeting, wringing hands, they are almost always lying. (especially if there is no reason for agitation). Also the tone of their voice changes. Slightly higher.

[capuchin]

Hey, cool responses...it fits what I've always heard about lying, where nervous behavior is generally considered to be suspicious.

I read an interesting article recently (which is probably what got me thinking about this) where a guy got wrongfully convicted (I think it was of murder?) because when the police questioned him, he averted eye contact and was sweating a lot. His nervous behavior made him seem less credible and thus the police pursued him much more aggressively as a suspect. I found that kinda fascinating.

For me, I don't think I'm good at detecting deception, or at least I'm not good at detecting it when I'm *trying* to. It's kinda like trying to get a date--the more effort I put into it, the less successful I am, so it's better to just go with that "gut feeling" and see how things turn out. Oddly enough, an overly friendly or engaging demeanor from someone that usually is more reserved is a red flag to me. For example, someone that is normally shy about eye contact who looks very deliberately in my eyes I suspect of lying, because I think they're *trying* to appear more honest/less nervous.

[TomCat]

really? how do we know your not making that up?

ok, assuming its correct. Do you mean looking with thier whole head or just thier eyes. Also, what if they are looking at the floor or up in air. Some people don't make eye contact when they talk.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Head and eyes avert to the left when lying.

[dragoth]

I can allmost allways tell by the eyes.

[Brenda Starrr]

I have an uncanny ability to tell when someone is lying to me.  I'll let doubt creep in and believe what I subconsciously know is BS.

.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Disclaimer: Neither Black Sunday9 nor myself have anything to do with this comment.

[soothsayer]

This is something which I have studied since I took psychology class in middle school. Not just the subject of human desception but also human behavior in general. I have found that over the (mumbles) years I have been keeping track of others behavior I have been able to predict how people will react and to a very accurate degree, if they are telling the truth or not. I am not saying that I am psychic but rather, people are for the most part predictable. Plain and simple.

I just watched a segment on 60 minutes tonight about a man that can tell when someone is being deceptive. It was very amazing to watch him do this and he even went into detail about how he did it. As it turned out, I have used the same techniques he uses. It is simple really to tell, what you need to keep in mind is, of course, different people lie differently. There is no one way for everyone but, everyone has their own way in which they will act/react when telling a lie. With that in mind you can then narrow it down to the next part which is that there are only X number of ways people will behave when doing this. From there it's just a matter of keeping an eye on the person that might have you wondering about their level of honesty. After that it is pretty easy to know when they're honest and when they're not.

I have more thoughts about this topic but my fingers are gonna fall off if I keep typing right now so I will come back later.

[capuchin]

This is something which I have studied since I took psychology class in middle school. Not just the subject of human desception but also human behavior in general. I have found that over the (mumbles) years I have been keeping track of others behavior I have been able to predict how people will react and to a very accurate degree, if they are telling the truth or not. I am not saying that I am psychic but rather, people are for the most part predictable. Plain and simple.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

See, this is something that both excites and confuses me as a psych major. Because there's so much mixed research on the stuff. On the one hand, there's a ton of research that points to how inaccurate our social judgements are (a lot of this is being done with psychologists as well as police) but on the other hand, there's also a lot that states our "snap judgements"/intuition/etc tends to be highly accurate.

And I agree, people do tend to lie differently and react differently--it's kind of fascinating to me because it seems like the people most likely to get away with a lie are the ones who are most skilled and experienced with it. My b/f sees this a lot in his work (he does network security stuff) and how companies security are most easily penetrable by someone who looks like they belong there/seem to know what they're doing. It's amazing how much trust is contingent on the appearance of confidence...

[soothsayer]

On the one hand, there's a ton of research that points to how inaccurate our social judgements are (a lot of this is being done with psychologists as well as police) but on the other hand, there's also a lot that states our "snap judgements"/intuition/etc tends to be highly accurate.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am a firm believer that there are exceptions to every rule. Every case is different. I also believe that there are only so many ways in which a person will behave when telling a lie. It's just a matter of watching for those signs. Of course, it also helps that I'm not getting graded on my results or conclusions. There for, no pressure on me.

[Daevion]

My b/f sees this a lot in his work (he does network security stuff) and how companies security are most easily penetrable by someone who looks like they belong there/seem to know what they're doing. It's amazing how much trust is contingent on the appearance of confidence...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Your absolutely right on that! I've seen and experienced this being that I do work as security at a major company. Its a continuing issue where I work, simply because of the shear number of people that actually work and have access. The company is global and has so many people coming and going from other installations all over the world. There are alot of measures in place that try and prevent this, but no matter how many there I think a very clever individual will and can get past it. Its a very boring job most of the time, so its very easy for someone ( myself included ) to slip into a lax state and let some things get by. In general security is very tight and very few things get thru without someone being aware of it, heh, I've heard some employees complain that security is TOO good and feel like they're in a prison camp. lol

[capuchin]

Your absolutely right on that! I've seen and experienced this being that I do work as security at a major company. Its a continuing issue where I work, simply because of the shear number of people that actually work and have access.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, and it really is funny how far confidence goes. One of his clients had him actually physically break into one of the secure areas (as opposed to the hacker-type stuff they usually want him to do) and he was able to walk right into their data room. The client happened to be a bank, and so he was able to access countless customers' account data. Suffice to say, the bank wasn't pleased at all when he gave his report

The problem as I see it is that people in general are trained to look for suspicious behavior, but that doesn't account for all those people that *know* people look for suspicious behavior, and simply make a point to not appear suspicious. The best way to deceive someone is to fit in...

[Fierce Critter]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and admit that I am a hell of a liar. I don't lie to my husband, and I don't lie to friends. But I am damned good at it when I want to. Long story, but suffice it to say the "talent" was a necessary evil to keep my sanity growing up in a decently repressive household (mama wouldn't suffer if she didn't know where I was REALLY at and what I was REALLY doing on my overnights away from the home).

I say this because I think it may be my "talent" that makes it so easy for me to spot BS. It makes it easy for me to see when someone is "acting" or being insincere.

That, and the fact that I have a talent for empathy, something I don't wanna go into because it sounds like hogwash. While I'm skeptical myself of a lot of ESP and stuff like that, I know what I've done/known/felt and I just don't like talking about it all that much.