what do you beleive in?

[Fierce Critter]

I do have a certain amount of respect and admiration for people who read religion-based texts as a means of broadening their knowledge base. Education of any sort is pretty much a good thing.

But I learned a long time ago that the deepest spirituality often comes from those who stop looking at outside sources and simply look within.

[Msterbeau]

I do have a certain amount of respect and admiration for people who read religion-based texts as a means of broadening their knowledge base. Education of any sort is pretty much a good thing.

But I learned a long time ago that the deepest spirituality often comes from those who stop looking at outside sources and simply look within.

*Bing* :-)

[torn asunder]

there will be no insulting or name calling in this thread - do i make myself clear?

[kellygrrrrrl]

Thanks!

I think your pretty cute too! And your really freaking smart too.....which I will admit, for simple minded girl, is quite intimidating!

But, Um.....wow.....I think I definately "missed something" here..... :fear =(

So.....I will stand back and dodge these bullets!

:fear

I have met Steven & Steve. I actually met both of them in the same room together at the same time... (Actually I met GOC Steve while Brenda was in town last year at Luna's for about 20 minutes) Doing good deeds for someone who was in desperate need.

Which to me, regardless of faith, or beliefs, was a very noble thing of both of them to do....regardless of thier conflicting opinions and whatnot, they were still able to come together and do something for somebody.....this is key to a successful society, I think....to put aside social/religious/economical/racial/historical/ethical etc..... :blink differences and just stand up and do what is friggin right!

You both remember right? :cheerful

Come together, riiightnow.....

can you finish this lyric???

[BrassFusion]

Ova me.

*shoop bop doobledy-DOO, shwooooooooooo..."

The world needs more Kellys. Unfortunately I'm not one of them, lol.

[kellygrrrrrl]

Great....."Sound Effects"?

:laughing :laughing :laughing :laughing :laughing

"LoL"-ing....right about now....

[Steven]

Cheater cheater pumpkin eater!!!

Oh, and you know I love you. But NO namecalling.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

your right Bren....I did throw one out there. I'll go back and remove it, as well as my phone number, I think my point was made.....

[Steven]

Awwww....

Hey now....

Steves choice of belief system is his.

Perhaps an alternative belief system to some.

But to him it is very real.

He believes that having an opinion is important.

SO what if he refuses any Dogma....that is his choice.

He can only learn from his expiriences....and grow from them....

There is BUTTLOADS of information out there.....

He has obviously read a lot of material that the world has had to offer.

And from this...he can form an opinion...he's allowed!

But the thing Steve should also be sensitive about is that others may not agree.  Which is fine.

No need to get heated, or point fingers....or single out.

Sounds like we're all a little fucked up on the whole subject.

We all have opinions on the subject, but is anybody right?

Nobody is right, everybody is wrong.......until the day comes when the big guy in the sky comes down and tells us what is up.....or until the day the earth explodes! :innocent

All we can do is live with some level of morality, respect to others/our surroundings, a calm heart, patience, and understanding that you, me, they we, are not perfect.

Nobody can hold anybody higher than anyone else. 

The only thing that is under you is the ground.

We all have something in common.

We all want to be right.

But we are not.

No matter how much proof you have, because there is always something to disprove you.

Am I missing the point here?

(I think I might be....)???? :fear  :whistling

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am a fan of Kellygrrrlll

[Steven]

I do have a certain amount of respect and admiration for people who read religion-based texts as a means of broadening their knowledge base. Education of any sort is pretty much a good thing.

But I learned a long time ago that the deepest spirituality often comes from those who stop looking at outside sources and simply look within.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Steven]

I have a pretty good theory. Steve and Kelly never got into the same debate that Steven and Steve did because Steve is, at his core, shallow and Kelly's a very pretty, very sweet girl.

Steven just can't hold a candle to her in the pretty and/or sweet category, so Steve has no reason to pretend to respect his opinions.

At first I almost respected you. Then I tried to look for reasons to continue being civil to you. Now you've proven that you don't deserve respect or even civility. So fuck you. Sideways. On the record.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

she has a much better butt than I do.

and I like her.

[kellygrrrrrl]

I like you too Steven!

And you're quite the catch yourself!

I've always kinda thought you was a sexy kind of guy! :blushing tee-hee :blushing

Oh - and I wanna braid your hair....at least run my fingers through it at least once!

:laughing

You DO know about my hair fetish......??

Hair obsession....

OCD with hair....

[Steven]

Perhaps you should reread the thread.  Start from the beginning.  I was not the one that 

acted first.  I'll finish a fight, but I'm not here looking for one.

I don't disagree at all.  And again, I don't care how people live their lives.  Its really none of my business.  Kellygrrrl for example, I would consider one of my best friends (offline).  She's christian.  Ask her if we ever had an argument like this.

The reality is, the ideas I presented may or may not be something that you've thought about before.  Does that mean they should be discredited?

Ask Copernicus how he feels about that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK first - nobody's fighting with you - your fighting with them, and attempting to assert your superior intillect over them in an effort to dismiss their experience in favor of your own as deserving of any credit. Add to that this statement about your being able to finish a fight - what are you trying to prove and to whom? You are finishing nothing here, there are no foes that have been dispatched.....

Torn is right: there are many ways to learn, and many things to be learned.

Kelly is right: none of us know it all, and all of us are flawed.

Camille is right: the deepest forms of spirituality come from within as opposed to a gathering of researchable data from outside sources.

And I am right: Sometimes I fuck up. But I own what I do, all of it.

And you DO have issues with the way people live their lives. Stay your course man, you contradict yourself. For example my Xtian ignorance bothers you. This I gather from the thigns you've written. A man like me apparently causes you discomfort. YOU say this, i do not. And here's my not so secret secret: that I too, have issues with the way that people live their lives. I do. I've said it before. But there is a difference overall, in what i do in here versus what you do.

I'm also not attempting to discredit you in my disagreements. Again I cite the way you present yourself in that you seem to desire to conquer me and/or others. You always come in the door flashing your credentials like you are an agent of the Mind Police. but life and experience and wisdom is made up of so much more than the laudible referances you seem to use as validation. And everyone in this community has tremendous value and potential and personal power. If I call you on something - I'll call YOU - on what YOU are doing. I have not done this until recently, and only because you chose to deliberately disrespect me and yet you still do not address me directly. And no, I will not ask Kelly or "Copernicus" or anybody else about you - I'll just ask you.

[Steven]

I like you too Steven!

And you're quite the catch yourself!

I've always kinda thought you was a sexy kind of guy! :blushing tee-hee :blushing

Oh - and I wanna braid your hair....at least run my fingers through it at least once!

:laughing

You DO know about my hair fetish......??

Hair obsession....

OCD with hair....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOL you better move quick babe....its getting thinnner every day as I inch closer to 40......

[kellygrrrrrl]

Bald guys are sexy too......

:blink :whistling :laughing

[Troy Spiral (13)]

Within the context of what will be viewed as "the rules of the game" on DGN. Two wrongs dont make right. If someone offends you, and in justifiable fury you "offend them back" both posts need to be not on the board. This isn't directed at anyone in particular, just that I've often heard , from time to time this "billy did it first" argument. While i do think maybe there is a certain philosophy that would say "do unto others as they do unto you" that's not the case here on DGN.

Its your job (the reader) to remain civil and if you care to, help others remain civil. If you (the reader) cant do that, regardless of context, it will be "your fault" when it comes time for a moderator to make a decision.

This is meant to be a place for "civil discussion" , unfortunately it is the moderators and ruleset that decide what is, and isn't allowed on a privately owned system like this, not ones own personal viewpoint. Saying "you are dumb" is an example of a clear insult also "your being dumb" or "your ideas are dumb" are all close enough to each other that in terms of DGN , they are too rude of statements to be used. You can make your points without using such , true or not, comments. Does that means somone would be insta-banned for such language? No of course not, we all have our moods, but if it was a continual pattern, with no changes eventually it might lead to that.

Maybe someone is not a polite person by nature, but eventually , they will have to learn to at least act somewhat polite to maintain a presence on DGN.

Again not directed at anyone in particular.

[Guest Game of Chance]

*Bing*  :-)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

lol, that's what they're all about. That was the entire point. There are certain methods however, that shall we say "quicken" the process.

[Guest Game of Chance]

OK first - nobody's fighting with you - your fighting with them, and attempting to assert your superior intillect over them in an effort to dismiss their experience in favor of your own as deserving of any credit.  Add to that this statement about your being able to finish a fight - what are you trying to prove and to whom?  You are finishing nothing here, there are no foes that have been dispatched.....

Torn is right:  there are many ways to learn, and many things to be learned.

Kelly is right:  none of us know it all, and all of us are flawed.

Camille is right:  the deepest forms of spirituality come from within as opposed to a gathering of researchable data from outside sources.

And I am right:  Sometimes I fuck up.  But I own what I do, all of it.

And you DO have issues with the way people live their lives.  Stay your course man, you contradict yourself.  For example my Xtian ignorance bothers you.  This I gather from the thigns you've written.  A man like me apparently causes you discomfort.  YOU say this, i do not.  And here's my not so secret secret:  that I too, have issues with the way that people live their lives.  I do.  I've said it before.  But there is a difference overall, in what i do in here versus what you do. 

I'm also not attempting to discredit you in my disagreements.  Again I cite the way you present yourself in that you seem to desire to conquer me and/or others.  You always come in the door flashing your credentials like you are an agent of the Mind Police.  but life and experience and wisdom is made up of so much more than the laudible referances you seem to use as validation.  And everyone in this community has tremendous value and potential and personal power.  If I call you on something - I'll call YOU - on what YOU are doing.  I have not done this until recently, and only because you chose to deliberately disrespect me and yet you still do not address me directly.  And no, I will not ask Kelly or "Copernicus" or anybody else about you - I'll just ask you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I give up.

Call me on something. You really want to make this a true pissing match, lets compare cocksizes while we're at it.

The only issue I have with how you live your life is how it effects future generations.

I long for the day when women are free from the Catholic guilt that so burdens them.

I long for the day when we have a gay president. When there's no such thing as a pro-lifer/choicer. How about truly being able to do my Will? How about being truly free?

I simply pointed out your lack of education in a certain area of knowledge, you took offense, and now its a big deal. Its not so much your "Xtian ignorance" that bothers me, as it is your quest to deny innummerable possiblities. I mention the name Aleister Crowley and it invoked in you a preconceived notion, of which you have no knowledge base to back it up with. PERIOD. Read up, and then we can talk. Communication is only possible between equals and frankly, I don't feel we're even speaking the same language.

I threw out a slam on overweight girls about two months ago (I probably shouldn't have) and now Brass Fusion has some kind of personal vendetta against me. Its cool, I don't really value much of what she has to say. I'm sure she'd say the same about me.

btw. Its the Illuminati that I'm an agent of. Not the mind police. :laughing

[Guest Game of Chance]

BTW...kudos to the Moderators for mostly staying out of this one. I was wondering when someone was going to say something about the name-calling. I do appreciate it.

[Guest Game of Chance]

I have met Steven & Steve.  I actually met both of them in the same room together at the same time...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In my living room, no less. I could have kept your wallet when you dropped it. I didn't (and still don't) know you. You still want to attack my moral fiber?

[Steven]

I give up. 

Call me on something.  You really want to make this a true pissing match, lets compare cocksizes while we're at it.

The only issue I have with how you live your life is how it effects future generations. 

I long for the day when women are free from the Catholic guilt that so burdens them.

I long for the day when we have a gay president.  When there's no such thing as a pro-lifer/choicer.  How about truly being able to do my Will?  How about being truly free?

I simply pointed out your lack of education in a certain area of knowledge, you took offense, and now its a big deal.  Its not so much your "Xtian ignorance" that bothers me, as it is your quest to deny innummerable possiblities.  I mention the name Aleister Crowley and it invoked in you a preconceived notion, of which you have no knowledge base to back it up with.  PERIOD.  Read up, and then we can talk.  Communication is only possible between equals and frankly, I don't feel we're even speaking the same language.

I threw out a slam on overweight girls about two months ago (I probably shouldn't have) and now Brass Fusion has some kind of personal vendetta against me.  Its cool, I don't really value much of what she has to say.  I'm sure she'd say the same about me.

btw.  Its the Illuminati that I'm an agent of.  Not the mind police.      :laughing

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

first of all - don't give up. engage. We both speak english....

we've taken turns offending one another. I called you an A hole. I was mad. Shouldent have done it. Should have just said "Hey - watch how you talk to me, I don't disrespect you this way" That would have been admittedly the wiser choice. But I opted for the easier option A. Absolutely true. In all fairness, you also - belittled me, and you seemed to be angry. So there we have it, a tit and a tat. and what have we acheived togethor?

And in response to you, I've allready called you on a great deal and am doing so even now. You did alot more than just point something out as you say. And in return if you are unwilling or unable to take a 2nd look at your style of delivery and their end result then you lack the wisdom you seem to claim that you have.

Now, for whatever reason you then spoke "around" me in response to my direct line to you. I seem to have your attention now - albeit at a higher temperature. I asked you before this turned ugly Steve - for some practical application examples of your life. I then went on to clarify (again before it started going bad) that it was indeed a legitimite question. I asked you - about you. It could have started cooling off right there. You could have perhaps have taught me somethign, and you didint. You could have shared a little of yourself, and you didint, with the exception of some pride. OK - your choice. But perhaps later you'll listen to the tone of how you opted out. It did (and does) make me suspicious about your core convictions and how deeply they are rooted. And since you choose not to share them - I am left to assume things on my own. See you can declare anything you want to about yourself, I've seen lots of men do that. It does not mean however - that your getting through. So I ask you..... are you getting through?

Oh, an cocksizes.

Honestly dude - are we having a macho-fest here? What do you think that I want to kick your ass or something? Again I warn you that I search the motivation behind what is being said as much as the verbage itself. What your not getting is that you have the potential to earn my respect. ANd your also not getting that I would give it rather quickly if given an opportunity to do so. You are not the only person Steve, that I have butted heads with in here. Those that I have butted heads with know, that I eventually always search for a way to re-connect with them and to receive something from them and to be honest they likewise have been very gracious with me. I'd like to beleive that we have even earned one another's respect. Your achilles - is your apparent inability to humble yourself, something that is surely NOT unique. When you demand the way that you do, I simply doubt you all the more. And again I ask.....Are you getting through?

Obviously I disagree with your statement about communication only being possible between equals. I think that's a pretty tired and convenient backdoor. I communicate with children. I communicate with my pets even. Never do I bother to sum up a person's worthiness prior to my deciding if I can communicate with them. And since you know the bible so well then you would know that I would value the model fo Christ himself who was incredibly effective at communicating with all men of all social status and educational backgrounds, because he was willing to mold himself to the need at hand. You yourself have quoted "LOVE IS THE LAW. But I dont see the action taking place. And take a look at the history of this online community Steve - we are all different types of people from different backgrounds with differetn languages and skillsets, different worldviews and experiences, and different social structures. and yet here we all are - communicating with one another, and every once in awhile even placing value in one another and creating friendships.

In my perception, your just a man named Steve, just like me, neither of us holding any lofty status. We are equals. You may feel as if you hold some special provision, but I do not recognize it, nor am I trying to impose one upon you. You are not illuminated. You are not a god. You do not have access to life giving or life changing power, you do not strike me as a leader, and you stifle yourself, with the pride of yourself. Its not what you say to me man, it's how you deliver the line. Despite what you tell me, I can see you.

And now here's my admission: I do the same thing. Once again, we are equals.

I cant speak for Brass on how she feels about you. Yes I remember the slam about being overweight. How long did it take you to own your possible mistake? What size crowbar was needed to pry a partiall admission of error on your part?

You see i can look at you and still very easily say that your a smart guy. Or perhaps....well read as you'd like me to acknowledge. Neither of thsoe thigns make you an effective man unto themselves. They are tools, gifts, potentials. What have you done with them? What WILL you do.....with what you have at yrou disposal?

[Steven]

In my living room, no less.  I could have kept your wallet when you dropped it.  I didn't (and still don't) know you.  You still want to attack my moral fiber?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

strange question, because I can't seem to locate the moral fiber attack.

yes you gave me back my wallet. cool. but hey - it belonged to me. I also noticed that day when you gave it back to me that you asked me "how's that for honesty?"

why'd you ask me that question Steve?

Why did it matter to you that I would consider you to be honest?

and why would I ask this question of you now?

[pharoh]

I believe in he who walks behind the rows.....shit I was supposed to die at 18.......bummer :erm

[Guest Game of Chance]

LOL...seriously I could take the time to cut and paste from your post and respond to your numerous questions, but its really easier to just drop it and move on.

You want some examples from my life? I don't have a college degree, yet I'm highly successful in one of the best-paying jobs in the world (in a bear market, mind you, so success is relative). There are people that make in excess of $5million a year that do exactly the same thing as I do. Most people in my profession have MBA's from Wharton. I trade millions of dollars in bonds every day. Curious that I made it into this.

Is it talent? Partly, but there are a lot of talented people out there.

Is it skills? Partly, but anyone can build up the skills.

Was it the magickal experiments I did? Possibly. It would be naive of me to say for certain.

Has the thought occured to you that I may not be able to (as in under oath) discuss these matters in a public forum? I invited you to PM me. If you care to learn more, feel free to do so. I've given you all the tools necessary for exploration on your own in the links I provided throughout the thread.

The ball is in your court.

[Guest Game of Chance]

strange question, because I can't seem to locate the moral fiber attack.

yes you gave me back my wallet.  cool.  but hey - it belonged to me.  I also noticed that day when you gave it back to me that you asked me "how's that for honesty?"

why'd you ask me that question Steve?

Why did it matter to you that I would consider you to be honest? 

and why would I ask this question of you now?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I should have kept it and donated the money to an abortion clinic.l

[Steven]

I should have kept it and donated the money to an abortion clinic.l

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

or you could just answer the question....