Flamboyantly Straight?

[Fierce Critter]

(I am interested in this in a sociological way, thus the placement of it in this forum.)

Christopher Lowell:

Richard Simmons:

Kynt from "The Amazing Race (he's the one on the left):

Just a few guys I can think of that come off EXTREMELY gay, but claim to be totally straight.

I'm not sure why I find this interesting, but I do. I think it's because I'm pretty much, I dunno what to call myself, "gay accepting?" "Homo-empathetic?" Whatever. Basically, I don't have any problem with gay people, and have gay relatives I love who basically give me a good impression of things "gay."

Even talking about it as something "particular" in this way bothers me. I really don't put that much conscious thought into this, no more than I'd give any of my neighbors, acquaintances, really.

But I find it interesting that there are some people, mostly guys, who give off extremely homosexual vibes, yet claim to be straight.

Christopher Lowell is married. I guess he's claimed that he went with the somewhat flamboyant personality because it's kinda "expected." Hmmm...

And Richard Simmons has been a bit more furtive about the subject, but overall claims straighthood.

Scott Thompson, formerly the self-proclaimed "faggo" from The Kids in the Hall, has said in interviews how ludicrous it is for people to claim there's no such thing as being born gay. He gives his own traits, including a sort of lispy speaking voice, as proof that there are truths to some of the stereotypes. A show I saw once on gays in film history included people like Harvey Fierstein, who is proud to consider himself "A sissy," and to enjoy the portrayal of sissy-types on screen.

I have two cousins who are gay. Neither of them have used the term in reference to themselves. One is obvious. He's been living with his partner AND my aunt for over 20 years. The other comes from a family of "jocks". And I don't think there's a chance in hell he'll ever come out to anyone in the family, even me and my sisters who he adores and I believe he knows he can trust. I last saw him at a funeral, with a "co-worker" who, to me and my sisters, was obviously his boyfriend.

Both of them exhibit some stereotypical "gay" traits. The one who lives with my aunt is flamboyant to a point, used to co-own a bar with his partner that featured drag shows, dresses, well, more colorful than most he-men I know. His voice isn't quite lispy, but he has a tone that's, to me at least, unmistakeable.

The other cousin? Know what tipped me off at first that he might be gay? The eye roll. I NEVER EVER see any man who is not gay do the eyeroll. I think there are some who might know exactly what I mean. He is more of the sort of non-stereotypical gay that you see in film portrayals such as Tom Hanks in Philadelphia. There's some speaking pattern there, some ways he carries his hands that tipped me and my sisters (who are also non-judgmental, and I have even slightly expected at times might lean lesbian) a long time ago that he is gay.

I didn't mean this to become a book. This is just something I find interesting, and wonder if others have observed similar things. I don't see anything wrong with it, and I'm not out to "out" anyone. I'm just intrigued.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Doesn't Richard just tell people it's none of thier business if he is gay or straight?

[Fierce Critter]

Doesn't Richard just tell people it's none of thier business if he is gay or straight?

I read recently that he's been asked, and has mostly said it's none of anyone's business. But he kinda alternates with claiming that he's just flamboyant, not gay.

[Head Wreck]

hey. i do the eyeroll...

and i have a lysp.

[GothicRavenGoddess (3)]

top two are gay... both have admitted at one time or another.. i think it was on *drum roll* Oprah... lol

that last d00d... i think that they are together, cuz he thinks that she is as pretty as he is, and she uses a vibrating strap on.. so.... yeah......

[Fierce Critter]

top two are gay... both have admitted at one time or another.. i think it was on *drum roll* Oprah...

Christopher Lowell was married while doing his show, and as far as I know, is still married.

I don't believe Simmons has ever said the words, "I am a homosexual" or any variant thereof.

I can't say. I mean, come on - he LOVES BARBRA STREISAND. What more proof do you need, eh?

Still, it's not for me to say. Maybe he just really likes sequins.

[Onyx]

I do seem to recall Richard Simmons saying he is gay.

I saw him in person one time and he looks really damn good in person. My reaction to him really surprised the hell out of me because I always thought of him as totally goofy and never paid much attention. He was very magnetic and personable and seemed genuinely concerned about people.

Straight guys (who are really interested in women and say so) that give off "gay vibes" - I tend to be very attracted to. What are gay vibes really though? Aren't they just saying "fuck you" to expectations of society - sort of the way straight men wear skirts to goth clubs.

Interesting subject.

[Der Nister]

I have noticed that it seems that gay men have female role models and straight men have male role models so it would make sense that a gay man would want to emulate his role models (Cher - Liza for example) so I guess that would include dress style among other things.

When I was 17 this girl I was dating, her older brother talked in a feminine style and liked singing Madonna songs and I thought it was odd until I realized he was always spending time with his male friend but anywhoz.........

From that and hearing about stereo types it would seem that if the shoe fits.

[GothicRavenGoddess (3)]

my mom's gay, i'm bi.. oh, and gay men have been marring women for years.... just cuz he's married to her, doesn't mean he's having sex w/ HER.. maybe they did at one time (if he's got kids) but maybe it was just easier to stay married and lead seperate lives... who knows... Christopher Lowell is DEFINATLY GAY

[Nienna]

Maybe the gay acting guys aren't gay, just "metro"?? LOL

My man Like candles, and romance and chick movies. He loves clothes more than I do and he ca do some mean eyeliner. DEFINATELY straight thoiugh.

[the eternal]

I'm sure there are many guys like Nienna's boyfriend, who are straight, yet are open to their feminine side.

It's a lot easier to do these days than it used to. I don't even like the term "feminine side," maybe "emotional side" or "sensitive side"

We live in a society that is more open to expression of feelings. It used to only be allowed for women. This is especially true when it comes to childrearing. Men are now encouraged to be loving to their kids.

That said there are obviosly still two sets of rules for men and women when it comes to expressing oneself, it's just not as strict anymore.

As for men, who claim to be straight, but are more open and tend to give off a gay vibe, they could be bisexual.

[saechalyn]

Maybe the gay acting guys aren't gay, just "metro"?? LOL

My man Like candles, and romance and chick movies. He loves clothes more than I do and he ca do some mean eyeliner. DEFINATELY straight thoiugh.

That's hot. I love straight boys with a femmy side (well not Richard Simmons, if he is in fact straight...)

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Personally, I think a person's sexuality preference is their own damn business. I don't think anyone has a right, if thats the correct word, to label anyone else as gay, straight or bi if said person says they are something else. Well, you can label them I suppose, that does not mean your correct.

My favorite and closest cousin is straight. Yet, most people label him as gay. He is extremely feminine in his demeanor and mode of speech. People have given him shit his whole life for being "gay". Called him a fag and other names as insults. We actually got in a fist fight one night at a bar because they didn't want "his kind" in the bar. Honestly, you should not call a someone names and try to get between them and their Apple martini if you don;t know what they do for a living. Lifers in the military know how to fight.

[Msterbeau]

Personally, I think a person's sexuality preference is their own damn business. I don't think anyone has a right, if thats the correct word, to label anyone else as gay, straight or bi if said person says they are something else. Well, you can label them I suppose, that does not mean your correct.

My favorite and closest cousin is straight. Yet, most people label him as gay. He is extremely feminine in his demeanor and mode of speech. People have given him shit his whole life for being "gay". Called him a fag and other names as insults. We actually got in a fist fight one night at a bar because they didn't want "his kind" in the bar. Honestly, you should not call a someone names and try to get between them and their Apple martini if you don;t know what they do for a living. Lifers in the military know how to fight.

Word.

[hunhee]

Oh come on, everyone labels, and i don't mean just the gay thing, i mean EVERYTHING.

Stereotypes and generalizations and categorization are all there for a reason. It's a simple way of putting things neatly into baskets. If we didn't generalize/stereotype/label, we wouldn't honestly know what to do with ourselves. It would seriously take WAY too much time to meet everyone and interview them in depth not to generalize, and even then we would STILL have to generalize, there's no way you can every really KNOW everyone...

For example:

I check out guys all the time.. I go hmm.. that guys a jock.. <reject noise> not interested. That's my less than one second judgement on how the person is dressed, walks, looks, completely superficial.. and i've already judged him. I'm putting this as an example because said person could be into playing magic, an astrophysicist, with four PhD's, completely altruistic, and deeply involved in trying to figure out the meaning of life the universe and everything (all things that i would find attractive in a guy, and his fav. movie is spaceballs... hehe) but I've already rejected him because that's what we do as people.

Hmm.. i think I'm going to have to just walk around and ask guys if they like spaceballs.... o0o0 I've found a new weeding tool.. OR even better, if they know the answer to life, the universe, and everthing...

I guess what I'm saying is that people see stereotypes as negative, but the reason why they're around is because GENERALLY (meaning most of the time/i didn't say all of the time) those stereotypes are true.

On a side note, I usually find gay men attractive. I have had two pseudo boyfriends who ended up coming out of the closet after i went steady with them (for lack of a better phrase).

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

I can right Peach on every Lemon in the bin... they are still Lemons.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

btw.. I do agree with you on labeling. It goes to how our brains function. Yet, I am willing to admit we sometimes label things incorrectly.

[Fierce Critter]

I'm sure there are many guys like Nienna's boyfriend, who are straight, yet are open to their feminine side.

It's a lot easier to do these days than it used to. I don't even like the term "feminine side," maybe "emotional side" or "sensitive side"

I have often said how lucky I am to be married to a guy who displays a healthy "sensitive" side. Jon can watch a chick flick with me, enjoys cooking and other domestic acts, and especially when we first got married, had a lot of feminine physical traits (slim build, luxurious long hair, eyelashes that a woman would kill for, well-groomed eyebrows). I don't swing Bi or Lesbian, but I admit some of these feminine-like features can be very attractive in certain dosages in a man.

As for men, who claim to be straight, but are more open and tend to give off a gay vibe, they could be bisexual.

It's funny. I find more people unwilling to admit to their bisexuality than to being full-on homosexual. It's like the pull is there to swing both ways, but they're so fearful of being perceived as anything but STRAIGHTER THAN STRAIGHT that they deny themselves the pleasure of the company of both sexes.

I actually do find women attractive. I can think of several women I've met who give me a bit of a visual/intellectual jolt. And I really like the thought of kissing women. However, it stops there. I have no interest in actual sex with a woman, and I don't find the thought of settling down in a domestic relationship with a woman the least bit interesting. Sexually and domestically, I'm definitely straight. But I'm learning to become comfortable with being intrigued by a certain type of woman and even being turned on by maybe a sexy dance with one, or even some kissing. The thing that stops me from doing any of that is I'm loyal and monogamous in my relationships. I am a married woman, and that means I don't kiss, touch or pursue ANYONE, no matter the sex.

Even if Jon does dip into "typical man" territory in his assurances that, "Hey, if you wanna kiss a girl at City Club, I won't mind! By all means - go ahead!"

MEN.

[Hellion]

And then theres to accusations of people being called pedophiles,terrorists,childed molesters,rapists,seriel killers,society and its assumptions with no proof,just labels.

Basically I don't give a f%$@ing Sh%t what anybody, is as long as they are not a threat to me,my family,and friends.

but then again pedophiles,terrorists,childed molesters,rapists,seriel killers should be IMOterrorized.

[Destroit]

Personally, I think the metrosexuals guys are straight...and they do it because they know chicks think it's hot, because well, we do. A good amount of us anyway...

Kinda like those "Girls Gone Wild" girls who are probably instinctually not bisexual, but do it on the camera to get "fame" and attention. Sorta like that.

[the eternal]

It's funny. I find more people unwilling to admit to their bisexuality than to being full-on homosexual. It's like the pull is there to swing both ways, but they're so fearful of being perceived as anything but STRAIGHTER THAN STRAIGHT that they deny themselves the pleasure of the company of both sexes.

I actually do find women attractive. I can think of several women I've met who give me a bit of a visual/intellectual jolt. And I really like the thought of kissing women. However, it stops there.

OMG this is becoming the thread that got everyone pissed off at me (incl you FC) back in the summer of 05 <cue Twilight Zone music> Of course, I was a teensy more brazen back then. Anyhoo----

That is one HUGE distinction between men and women.

It's perfectly acceptable, hell it's encouraged for women to find each other hot, AND act on it.

BUT

bisexuality, as an orientation, not just a one nighter,

is still thought of as weird , even for women.

Like you haven't decided who you are.

It goes back to what Hunhee said.

We, as a society, (edit--italicized for emphasis)

LIKE categories.

That's why the old It's Pat sketch on SNL was so funny.

You're trying to figure out if Pat's a man or woman.

(here's another little edit)

There are a lot of people that act as if

saying you're bisexual is like saying you're not committing to being straight OR gay,

and they just want you

to pick a side and choose one already!!!

(another edit)

Those people suck, or rather they don't,

and therefore they don't understand what it's like for someone who has impulse for both genders

Unfortunately, they're viewpoint is the norm.

And for men it's much worse.

It's considered very unmanly to be bisexual.

Like you're not a full man.

You're afraid to admit it, because

what if the woman you're interested is turned off when you tell her (I guarantee NO woman has that fear)

What if all your guy friends are afraid to hang out with you,

because if you're bi, you must want them (as if you'd actually hit on their ugly asses)

Or if they do hang out with you, what if they start acting different toward you?

So now it's not the same.

What if your family doesn't understand?

So, it's much EASIER to say that you're straight and sensitive, than admit you're bi.

AND, there's a chance that you don't even know it.

You're bi but you are confident that you're straight.

Since women are encouraged to explore that side of themselves and men aren't,

You never even considered the possibility that you could be anything else.

Ever have that friend who every one knew he was gay, except him????

It's even worse when you're bi, because people are like "he seems kinda gay,

but not completely and he loves getting together with women.

Of course the other possibility is---

YOU REALLY ARE STRAIGHT, and you're just a nice sensitive guy.

It all depends on the person

Men: Display emotions? OK

Watch chick flicks? Don't brag to the buddies, but, ok I guess

Show love to your kids and be an involved dad? Go for it!!!

Admit bisexuality? Hell no!

I understand you may have been in college, and decided you needed to actually get a GOOD blow job for a change ,

and you still had those boyish looks and slender physique

and you were horny

And g-d knows it's a lot easier to pick up a guy than a woman

But RESIST! RESIST!!

Because it's hot when two women are together, but sick and wrong when two men are together.

And your only safe haven is the ghetto.

The dark, dirty, public rest stops along I-94 (actually interstates), the final dumping ground for every fat, middle-aged, married, unhappy bi guy.

AND HIM

(which is why even I don't stop there to take a leak at night-I hold it)

PLEASE GIVE TO SAVE THE BISEXUALS

A little knowlege can go a long way

Just one less closeted bi man, could make a father and son welcome to use the stalls at exit 39.

A hundred less closeted men and you could save a whole rest area

Give now

Because hatred and fear should not keep them in the closet ....

and you with wet pants.

THANK YOU

________________________________________________________________________________

___________

This PSA is apparently not applicable to the women on this board,

who live in oppositeland where two guys together are hot,

and men exhibiting a gay vibe or sensitviity is actually attractive.

Thank you once again DGN for having made my love life amazingly easy and simple!

I am now going to call my sensitive-guy-loving partner where I hope to make plans to get together, watch a movie in my clean abode, and I'll tell her how much I love her

[Destroit]

I was gonna say that you have truthiness (GOD...I've been waiting for so long to use that word) and such wisdom...but then I read this:

This PSA is apparently not applicable to the women on this board,

who live in oppositeland where two guys together are hot,

and men exhibiting a gay vibe or sensitviity is actually attractive.

So had this post been applicable to me, I woulda been all or as "manly" jocks would say: HIGH FIVE!!! YEAH!! *subliminally homo body slam followed by ass slap* WOOO!

This post gives me odd urges to go watch Ultimate Foreplay...I mean Fighting Championship (UFC) on Spike TV for no reason in particular. Yeah...that's right...no reason...God I love that show!

[GothicRavenGoddess (3)]

you are entitled to your opinion. I like boys and girls. I refuse to chose, because sometimes, i like a warm squishy body to go home to, and I don't mean a fat man... lol I mean asking me to pick one and stick to it is like asking me to chose what days to breathe... come on. that's hardly fair. you are entitled to your opinion, tho. I respect that it is your opinion, but I don't like it. which im entitled to cuz its my opinion. so no, i will not chose. Sex is sex, whether it can make babies or not, and i'm not talking about anal (ewe). girls and boys, that's my choice. I am sticking to both.

[Destroit]

i like a warm squishy body to go home to, and I don't mean a fat man...

I will say, your post is fine except I must correct this one line. Boys are warmer than girls (they burn 700 more calories a day), generally bigger, and soft without being gooey like a bag full of women, I mean Jello-O, I definately meant Jell-O. I'm just pickin' on ya, I mean no harm, please 'scuse me

[Fierce Critter]

OMG this is becoming the thread that got everyone pissed off at me (incl you FC) back in the summer of 05 <cue Twilight Zone music> Of course, I was a teensy more brazen back then. Anyhoo----

Before I even read the rest of the post from which I pulled this quote, I want to respond.

My irritation at you came from your insistence that E.V.E.R.Y.O.N.E. on the planet has homosexual leanings in some way or another, and that those who insist otherwise are in some kind of denial.

You pissed other people off by basically telling people who said they were definitely straight and comfortable in that self-knowledge that they are in denial, near delusional, and basically that they aren't being honest with themselves.

It struck me as reverse discrimination. Just as wrong as a heterosexual trying to convince people that gays are gay by choice, not by biology, and can choose to change. You were trying to say that all humans are gay in some way. And I still refute that totally as ludicrous generalizing.

But I still luvs ya.

Now, I'll go finish reading that post and those that came after.