Warrentless Wire Taps

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Whole lot of outrage at me. Group think is so much fun...

[Shade Everdark]

Shade, I have refrained from saying that. I feel that that accusation, of "trolling", to be tantamount to forum board treason. If you were not nearly as respected, well... I refuse to speculate on the administrative actions of which I have no purview.

This is not to say that I disagree with you, but I cannot support you.

The beautiful thing about it, is that it needs no support, it is simply what it is.

If it comes to that, I'm willing to be DGn's Adlai Stevenson.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

in every single arena in which he's involved?

(honest question, as i don't have a lot of time to keep tabs on all of obama's policy-making and executive actions)

i will say this, i think stepping on the gas to rush financial infrastructure support was a good move - the lack of control/requirements/accountability really sucked, but i do admire his relatively decisive action, vs. bush's apparent administration of inaction.

of course, i will also admit to being misinformed, if i don't fully understand everything.

Not in every area. But when it comes to power grabs, he has siezed more power already than Bush did in his 8 years.

I mean, where exactly in the Constitution does the President get the power to fire the head of a private sector business?

He expanded the Warrantless wire tap program.

Moving the Census to his direct authority?

Half of his cabinet are tax cheats or under investigation for fraud and corruption.

[Slogo]

What about Obama's use of cocaine is school and his admission that it was "something you did when you ahd enough cash"?

It was when I did

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

It was when I did

You miss the point. She was faulting Bush for ever doing Cocaine, but seems to not realize that Obama did too.

[Rev.Reverence]

You miss the point. She was faulting Bush for ever doing Cocaine, but seems to not realize that Obama did too.

TRUE..he EVEN inhaled the Ganj'!

[Slogo]

You miss the point. She was faulting Bush for ever doing Cocaine, but seems to not realize that Obama did too.

See, it's shit like that where I don't care. Bush, Obama...I don't care if they shot up together, as long as it was 20 years ago and not now, i really don't give a fuck. Blowjobs, college drug use, religion, whether or not they wear a fucking pin on their jacket, these things don't bother me. Not being able to string a sentence together bothers me

[candyman]

See, it's shit like that where I don't care. Bush, Obama...I don't care if they shot up together, as long as it was 20 years ago and not now, i really don't give a fuck. Blowjobs, college drug use, religion, whether or not they wear a fucking pin on their jacket, these things don't bother me. Not being able to string a sentence together bothers me

If you grade based on sentence structure and composure during a speech I do believe that Hitler was one of the very few in history that did both very well...

Both Obama and Bush made and still make many mistakes during speeches...they are still human...

[Rev.Reverence]

If you grade based on sentence structure and composure during a speech I do believe that Hitler was one of the very few in history that did both very well...

Both Obama and Bush made and still make many mistakes during speeches...they are still human...

Naw dude...Churchill...& their contemporaries held Grammar in high accord...in FACT!..just about everyone at that time..& BEFORE THAT...used nigh on perfect Grammar.

So...screaming at the top of his lungs is composed? Gimme' a friekin' break kidd!

[candyman]

Naw dude...Churchill...& their contemporaries held Grammar in high accord...in FACT!..just about everyone at that time..& BEFORE THAT...used nigh on perfect Grammar.

So...screaming at the top of his lungs is composed? Gimme' a friekin' break kidd!

Well, he did shit fast and he did it right...and by that I mean speaking not actions. I was just saying that its stupid to think that someone is retarded based on their speaking ability alone. That is like saying that mentally challenged people have no ablities and are worthless. Thinking like that would have kept one of the greatest minds in the world from getting his work out there...but thanks to a mobile chair and a computer he can still kick the shit out of anyones brain.

Each speaker is composed in his own way...some scream and some speak softly. Almost all leaders at the time were great speakers...but back then there was something called dignity, and the media and the people were willing to ignore their leaders suffering from all the pressure. Now, people don't have the mental capacity to understand what these leaders, good or bad, are going through...this job has taken its toll on every single person that has had it.

The first three times I heard or saw Obama speak he messed up big time...but I did not hold that against him because I passed the fifth grade a long time ago and, yeah I am only 21 so I don't know shit yet, I understand that people in high positions are under some serious pressure and no matter what side they are on it will get to them.

Maybe I should be more critical of all the petty crap though...guess I will know better when I get to the magical age where people understand stuff...

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

See, it's shit like that where I don't care. Bush, Obama...I don't care if they shot up together, as long as it was 20 years ago and not now, i really don't give a fuck. Blowjobs, college drug use, religion, whether or not they wear a fucking pin on their jacket, these things don't bother me. Not being able to string a sentence together bothers me

I really dont care either but if you are going to fault one man for it, you really should fault the other for it too.

[torn asunder]

Whole lot of outrage at me. Group think is so much fun...

you know, this whole "martyr" bit is getting tired, gaf. you do so love it, though, don't you!?

i've decided...

sad.

[Tacohitts]

Ahhhhh!,Mr I expect everyone to agree with me has no following

better luck next time,now lets get back to what the real topic was about

without arguing.

[Slogo]

I really dont care either but if you are going to fault one man for it, you really should fault the other for it too.

I don't fault him for that

I don't think the media should've made more of Obama's drug use, just less of Bush's

[ttogreh]

Unfortunately for Bush, he was born into the party of moralism. I do not fault the man for making poor decisions and cleaning up. That took a great amount of will power, as well as an external support system. I don't fault Obama for playing around with substances, and for all practical effects, grew out of them.

I do fault both men for attempting to either expand or maintain extra-constitutional powers of the Presidency. Still, I am going to reserve judgement on the actions of the man in the Oval office for a little while longer. I can not withhold judgement forever, though.

In any event, it certainly is something that the Republicans can run on in 2010...

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Ahhhhh!,Mr I expect everyone to agree with me has no following

better luck next time,now lets get back to what the real topic was about

without arguing.

I have been trying to talk about the real topic. Except for a few exceptions every post has been an attack on my charactor for wanting to talk about the topic. Such as your post that has added so much to the conversation.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

I don't fault him for that

I don't think the media should've made more of Obama's drug use, just less of Bush's

I wasn't saying you did. I was refering to the person who made that comment.

[peelingchrome]

Unfortunately for Bush, he was born into the party of moralism. I do not fault the man for making poor decisions and cleaning up. That took a great amount of will power, as well as an external support system. I don't fault Obama for playing around with substances, and for all practical effects, grew out of them.

I do fault both men for attempting to either expand or maintain extra-constitutional powers of the Presidency. Still, I am going to reserve judgement on the actions of the man in the Oval office for a little while longer. I can not withhold judgement forever, though.

In any event, it certainly is something that the Republicans can run on in 2010...

I can agree with this statement fully, except for the part about reserving judgment. In my mind actions speak louder than words. I cannot even reserve judgment on candidates before they're elected, as their conduct carries a lot of meaning for me.

That being said, past drug use matters little to me. My privacy matters a LOT to me. While Bush started the issue, Obama has GREATLY expanded and protected it, and I am pretty disappointed in the man who offered so much change. Like someone in this thread previously metaphorized, I believe he is stepping on the gas of the oligarchic machine that he seems to be heading. I cannot have faith in a man who takes away my CONSTITUTIONALLY DEFENDED RIGHT TO PRIVACY. (Primarily Amendments 4 and 9, but also partly Amendments 1-3 and 5; Amendments 2, 3, and 5 refer to other aspects of privacy)

Article the sixth [Amendment IV]

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Article the third [Amendment I]

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Article the eleventh [Amendment IX]

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

My personal communications are mine, and I refuse to accept that they can be snooped into. Nuff said.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

I can agree with this statement fully, except for the part about reserving judgment. In my mind actions speak louder than words. I cannot even reserve judgment on candidates before they're elected, as their conduct carries a lot of meaning for me.

That being said, past drug use matters little to me. My privacy matters a LOT to me. While Bush started the issue, Obama has GREATLY expanded and protected it, and I am pretty disappointed in the man who offered so much change. Like someone in this thread previously metaphorized, I believe he is stepping on the gas of the oligarchic machine that he seems to be heading. I cannot have faith in a man who takes away my CONSTITUTIONALLY DEFENDED RIGHT TO PRIVACY. (Primarily Amendments 4 and 9, but also partly Amendments 1-3 and 5; Amendments 2, 3, and 5 refer to other aspects of privacy)

My personal communications are mine, and I refuse to accept that they can be snooped into. Nuff said.

didn't you read the posts? Defending your Rights is the wrong thing to do and a waste of time.

[phee]

didn't you read the posts? Defending your Rights is the wrong thing to do and a waste of time.

Where was this stated?

[torn asunder]

Where was this stated?

just let it go, man...

[phee]

just let it go, man...

Good thought

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Where was this stated?

twice in this thread by the same person

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

just let it go, man...

right, cause soemone saying something like that is so not worth commenting on.

[phee]

right, cause soemone saying something like that is so not worth commenting on.

Feel free to answer