Checkpoint Charlize

[Rev.Reverence]

I'm more refering to his tone when I said ignorant. The border patrol ageant has no say over the procedures she is suppose to enforced. To me it's like going up to a cashier at a store and bitching about how much something costs, like they have some control over the price setting.

If he 'sounded ignorant' ... how? I thought he sounded very informed...he had done a bit of research...was it not the impression that he was driving up there to do that...he sounds like a man at war to me...

[Rev.Reverence]

I disagree. Watching the video, I believe he was very well informed (not ignorant) & was testing a line of questioning to see if she would follow it. I don't think there was malice in it, nor was there "fame" to be sought. I get the feeling he was trying to make a point & to create an instructional video, perhaps for others to follow. I also feel that had he been detained, he would have continued questioning the agents but would have done what he was told.

Yeah... if he was lookin' for fame, wouldn't he be on the tape?

Oh yeah... but he was explicitly not going to answer a single question.

[savageminstrel]

Is it really such a hardship to answer one or two questions instead of giving someone just trying to do their job a hard time? I'm sure she doesn't like having to stop ever care either and asking the same things over again. Unforunatly thats one of the realities in this country now, and I don't like it either, but I was at least raised to respect people of authority. The guy would have probably been in and out of that check point in 30 seconds if he would have just answered her questions. Illigal immigration is a problem in this country, the border patrol is just trying to do their jobs. Under the 100 mile rule, they are well within their rights to set up a check point there.

You seem to miss the entire point.. it is illegal and unconstitutional to interfere and restrain people from travelling freely within the borders of the USA. It isnt about it being a hardship, or how easy it is to just answer a few questions. You cannot be required to give up ANY rights under the Constitution for ANY trumped up reasons. Illegal immigration has ALWAYS been a problem, there is NO valid reason for the govt. to stop and question people on the road, except when they are crossing the border.

Wake up, and stop being so willing to roll over and hand over your rights on a silver platter in the name of respecting authority. You have an obligation and a right in this country to question authority.... and well you should.

[Nightgaunt]

You seem to miss the entire point.. it is illegal and unconstitutional to interfere and restrain people from travelling freely within the borders of the USA. It isnt about it being a hardship, or how easy it is to just answer a few questions. You cannot be required to give up ANY rights under the Constitution for ANY trumped up reasons. Illegal immigration has ALWAYS been a problem, there is NO valid reason for the govt. to stop and question people on the road, except when they are crossing the border.

Wake up, and stop being so willing to roll over and hand over your rights on a silver platter in the name of respecting authority. You have an obligation and a right in this country to question authority.... and well you should.

I think I love you.

[Rev.Reverence]

You seem to miss the entire point.. it is illegal and unconstitutional to interfere and restrain people from travelling freely within the borders of the USA. It isnt about it being a hardship, or how easy it is to just answer a few questions. You cannot be required to give up ANY rights under the Constitution for ANY trumped up reasons. Illegal immigration has ALWAYS been a problem, there is NO valid reason for the govt. to stop and question people on the road, except when they are crossing the border.

Wake up, and stop being so willing to roll over and hand over your rights on a silver platter in the name of respecting authority. You have an obligation and a right in this country to question authority.... and well you should.

Ya...me too!

[TitsMcGee]

You seem to miss the entire point.. it is illegal and unconstitutional to interfere and restrain people from travelling freely within the borders of the USA. It isnt about it being a hardship, or how easy it is to just answer a few questions. You cannot be required to give up ANY rights under the Constitution for ANY trumped up reasons. Illegal immigration has ALWAYS been a problem, there is NO valid reason for the govt. to stop and question people on the road, except when they are crossing the border.

Wake up, and stop being so willing to roll over and hand over your rights on a silver platter in the name of respecting authority. You have an obligation and a right in this country to question authority.... and well you should.

According to the U.S. Border Patrol, it has a jurisdiction of about 100 miles from the border.

What this says to me that it is a completely LEGAL check point, under the law. And I have done my fair share of questioning authority, but I don't see a reason to question in this case since no ones rights are being violated.

My point is that if people have a problem with the check point, take it up with people that can actually do something about it, instead of being a dick to people just doing their jobs. That's the point you seem to be missing, is that being a dick to the border agent isn't going to do anything. I'm all for using your right to protest and shit but take it up with the right people, not someone on the bottom of the food chain.

[savageminstrel]

What this says to me that it is a completely LEGAL check point, under the law. And I have done my fair share of questioning authority, but I don't see a reason to question in this case since no ones rights are being violated.

My point is that if people have a problem with the check point, take it up with people that can actually do something about it, instead of being a dick to people just doing their jobs. That's the point you seem to be missing, is that being a dick to the border agent isn't going to do anything. I'm all for using your right to protest and shit but take it up with the right people, not someone on the bottom of the food chain.

Actually it is NOT a legal checkpoint. Checkpoints in this country are not legal for the purposes of fishing expeditions, which is exactly what the checkpoint in question is. If it were a legal checkpoint, then the person in the video would have been detained and arrested for failure to comply with an officer in the performance of her LEGAL duty. The fact that he wasn't should tell you that.

And yes in fact your rights are violated as soon as you are stopped and not allowed to proceed for an ILLEGAL checkpoint... and the supposed jurisdiction of 100 miles that the border patrol claims is debatable.

You know if people had held your attitude 240 years ago, we would still be a province of Britain.

[TitsMcGee]

Actually it is NOT a legal checkpoint. Checkpoints in this country are not legal for the purposes of fishing expeditions, which is exactly what the checkpoint in question is. If it were a legal checkpoint, then the person in the video would have been detained and arrested for failure to comply with an officer in the performance of her LEGAL duty. The fact that he wasn't should tell you that.

And yes in fact your rights are violated as soon as you are stopped and not allowed to proceed for an ILLEGAL checkpoint... and the supposed jurisdiction of 100 miles that the border patrol claims is debatable.

You know if people had held your attitude 240 years ago, we would still be a province of Britain.

Take the protest up with people who can actually do something to change it, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. I mean really trying to get that past you guys is like talking to a damn wall. Being a dick to a border agent 9 out of 10 times will just get you arrested. If you want things changed used your right to protest just protest the right people.

[peelingchrome]

If she was that worried about it, they could have easily run his plates and registration, and confirmed his American citizenship. I haven't met too many terrorists who have an Upstate NY accent, either. Duh. Keep reciting your orders by rote, Officer Puppet. You got pwned by a true American.

If we let mindless authority (this border patrol officer was obviously unprepared for an American citizen who knows their Constitutional rights) push us around, then what inconveniences and rules will come next, hmmm? Do we all nod our heads and smile like a bunch of halfwits, or do we SPEAK UP and RAISE HELL when things just don't seem the same anymore?!? I choose the second option, thank you very much.

Will we CONTINUE to live in FEAR and distrust of our own countrymen, which is just what the terrorists WANT? They desire nothing more than for us to be unbalanced from within, so we will be disorganized and WEAK next time they come to call.

This country was not built based upon FEAR, it was built from the STRENGTH of the people. Be STRONG, and know your RIGHTS!!!

According to most of the history I've read, this country was founded and profoundly influenced throughout its existence by people who were not afraid to stand up to authority when that authority was in the wrong. People having respect for authority, just because it IS authority, has never changed anything. Unions... civil rights... voting rights... none of those things came about via "respect for authority".

Could he have been a little more polite? Sure. Was he justified in being pissed off? Absolutely.

Respect for authority does not include letting said authority trample all over us. Legitimate authority derives its power from the consent of the governed. If we consent to minor violations of our rights, it can only lead to bigger and bigger violations.

If you have nothing to hide, just accept the cavity search. Accept CPS taking your children pending an investigation to make sure you're not hiding anything. Accept your labor camp assignment. As long as your papers are in order, there's nothing to worry about, right? Right? We all have to do our part and give up a few rights to beat the terrorists.

Just keep your head down, citizen.

We are not numbers, we are FREE MEN. Remember this.

REMEMBER THOMAS JEFFERSON, BENJAMIN FRANKLIN, ABRAHAM LINCOLN, and the other great patriots. REMEMBER THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

We have much adversity to face in the coming days. I hope everyone has prepared themselves to either fight global tyranny, or lay down and die for the dictators like a spineless piece of shit. We can either be weak as tap water, or strong as an ocean tidal wave.

Demand your desired quality of life, demand your right to travel freely without being hampered, express your valuable opinions, DEMAND YOUR ACCESS TO INFORMATION!!!!! PROTECT YOUR RIGHT TO FREEDOM, BEFORE IT IS TAKEN AWAY.

Nazi death camp soldiers were just doing their jobs. The Stasi were just doing their jobs. The Waco butchers were just following orders.

I do not see this as a valid excuse. When you become an officer of the law, you swear an oath to uphold the Constitution. When they violate this oath, they aren't doing their jobs. I disagree that the driver was behaving in an ignorant fashion. He understood his rights better than the officer sworn to uphold those rights. Had he immediately asked to see the person in charge, I wonder what her response would have been? Oh right... "Answer my question."

Understand that this is not being done to curb illegal immigration. This is not being done to fight terrorism. This is being done to condition us to accept a police state.

You seem to miss the entire point.. it is illegal and unconstitutional to interfere and restrain people from travelling freely within the borders of the USA. It isnt about it being a hardship, or how easy it is to just answer a few questions. You cannot be required to give up ANY rights under the Constitution for ANY trumped up reasons. Illegal immigration has ALWAYS been a problem, there is NO valid reason for the govt. to stop and question people on the road, except when they are crossing the border.

Wake up, and stop being so willing to roll over and hand over your rights on a silver platter in the name of respecting authority. You have an obligation and a right in this country to question authority.... and well you should.

Actually it is NOT a legal checkpoint. Checkpoints in this country are not legal for the purposes of fishing expeditions, which is exactly what the checkpoint in question is. If it were a legal checkpoint, then the person in the video would have been detained and arrested for failure to comply with an officer in the performance of her LEGAL duty. The fact that he wasn't should tell you that.

And yes in fact your rights are violated as soon as you are stopped and not allowed to proceed for an ILLEGAL checkpoint... and the supposed jurisdiction of 100 miles that the border patrol claims is debatable.

You know if people had held your attitude 240 years ago, we would still be a province of Britain.

I would like to say, sincerely, that I love each and every one of you quoted above. I love you from the bottom of my heart.

The man shooting the video did a good thing: he raised a question. He made people think. He did something legal and provocative to raise awareness regarding our true rights as American citizens.

And I, imho, don't think he was rude at all. I think he was giving the same as he got. She was stern and straightforward, he was also. Nothing wrong with giving as well as you get.

To all of you true Americans out there, I salute you and stand behind you 100%. Keep fighting for America!

P.S. Pardon my tardiness to this party, please.

[TitsMcGee]

I would like to say, sincerely, that I love each and every one of you quoted above. I love you from the bottom of my heart.

The man shooting the video did a good thing: he raised a question. He made people think. He did something legal and provocative to raise awareness regarding our true rights as American citizens.

And I, imho, don't think he was rude at all. I think he was giving the same as he got. She was stern and straightforward, he was also. Nothing wrong with giving as well as you get.

To all of you true Americans out there, I salute you and stand behind you 100%. Keep fighting for America!

P.S. Pardon my tardiness to this party, please.

So are you saying that people who disagree with what this guy did aren't true Americans? Because that is a slippery slope you're heading towards with comments like that.

[Goth Brooks]

You know if people had held your attitude 240 years ago, we would still be a province of Britain.

I'm comparing our current situation with Canada and Australia and trying to see the "bad" in this statement.

[Nightgaunt]

Take the protest up with people who can actually do something to change it, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. I mean really trying to get that past you guys is like talking to a damn wall. Being a dick to a border agent 9 out of 10 times will just get you arrested. If you want things changed used your right to protest just protest the right people.

I'm really not trying to sound like a dickhead here - and I'm sorry if it comes across that way - but it seems to me that you're the one not getting it. Just how does one take the protest up with the "people who can actually do something to change it"?

"Excuse me ever so much, but I'd like to speak with your boss' boss' boss so that I can exercise my Constitutional right to protest."

You protest when there's something to protest. This is not being a "dick" to the border agent. This is doing your duty as an American citizen. This attitude that you should bow your head and meekly do whatever you're told to avoid punishment absolutely baffles me. I don't care if it's the lowest grunt in the chain of command just doing his job, I'm going to protest. I'm going to assert my rights. I'm going to get in their blank soulless face and make them understand that I am free, regardless of what their Patriot Act or Homeland Security Presidential Directive say. If they want to shoot me, fine. At least I'd die free and with a clear conscience. And no, I do not say that lightly.

Take a look around you. Tear your eyes away from the TV news propaganda and do a few simple searches online to find out what's going on right under our noses. I humbly suggest:

www.army.mil/usapa/epubs/pdf/r210_35.pdf

Google: Internet 2

Google: North American Union

Google: Real ID Act

Google: Project for the New American Century

Google: Bilderberg 2008

Things are not okay. We're not going to "weather the crisis" and "emerge stronger than ever" or whatever buzzphrases the President is spewing these days. The infrastructure of a police state has been put into place all around us and we sit around and talk about who's going to be the next American Idol and argue about which corrupt scuzzbag politician will be best for the country.

So yeah, if I ever meet the guy who was rude to that poor little border agent, I'm gonna buy him a steak dinner and a Cuban cigar, and pin a medal on his chest.

The answer to 1984 is 1776.

**Edited to fix grammatical errors.

[savageminstrel]

Take the protest up with people who can actually do something to change it, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. I mean really trying to get that past you guys is like talking to a damn wall. Being a dick to a border agent 9 out of 10 times will just get you arrested. If you want things changed used your right to protest just protest the right people.

It isn't about protesting, it is about standing up for your own rights against their violation by agents of the government. Being a dick to any agent in the performance of their LEGAL duty will get you arrested 10 out of 10 times. This agent was obviously NOT doing her LEGAL duty by stopping people without probable cause as is set forth in the law, or the man recording the video WOULD have been detained.. there is no doubt about that. If the agent was within her lawful authority, he would have been arrested for refusing to comply. Period.

Protest all you want, but it is your duty and right as a citizen of this country to stick up for your own rights, because the government isn't going to do it for you... in fact they are the ones who will be attempting to violate the very rights they are sworn to uphold.

It's not about changing things, its about resisting tyranny. If you trust someone else to stand up for your rights, then you will see them lost.

*edited to correct grammatical errors*

[savageminstrel]

I'm comparing our current situation with Canada and Australia and trying to see the "bad" in this statement.

Hmmmmm, I see what you mean..... lmfao. (I laugh, but it is actually a very sad thing)

[peelingchrome]

So are you saying that people who disagree with what this guy did aren't true Americans? Because that is a slippery slope you're heading towards with comments like that.

Not quite. What I'm saying is that people who disagree with WHY he did what he did aren't standing up for what this country was founded on. Whether he went about it in a way that was palatable to you or not, he stood up for his rights. A wise man (I forget which one) once said, "Do what you can, with what you have, at the moment." To me, this says to to do the best you can every moment of every day. When tyranny encroaches on the free people of this nation, we free people are responsible for resisting said tyranny every day in every way possible. This man was not being any more rude than the border patrol agent was. This man was practicing civil disobedience, nothing more. I know that acting in such a manner to the bottom of the totem pole, so to speak, will not accomplish much at that moment except for a traffic jam. Yet he made a statement. What are the chances that that particular border patrol agent went home thinking about exactly what she was doing? I know that the video has given many people something to think about and debate.

This man acted in a lawful manner with the same amount of respect that he was given. I, personally, don't see anything wrong with his actions. What matters most, though, is that it is now a subject for conversation and people are thinking about it. If enough people are outraged, on either side of this disctussion, the next step would be to DO something instead of just talking about it. What could be better for our country than people taking a stand and ACTING on their beliefs instead of just bitching and whining? Whatever the beliefs, people need to get off of their asses and do something. Nothing will ever change if all we do is piss and moan.

Is that a bit more clear?

[jynxxxedangel]

Not quite. What I'm saying is that people who disagree with WHY he did what he did aren't standing up for what this country was founded on. Whether he went about it in a way that was palatable to you or not, he stood up for his rights. A wise man (I forget which one) once said, "Do what you can, with what you have, at the moment." To me, this says to to do the best you can every moment of every day. When tyranny encroaches on the free people of this nation, we free people are responsible for resisting said tyranny every day in every way possible. This man was not being any more rude than the border patrol agent was. This man was practicing civil disobedience, nothing more. I know that acting in such a manner to the bottom of the totem pole, so to speak, will not accomplish much at that moment except for a traffic jam. Yet he made a statement. What are the chances that that particular border patrol agent went home thinking about exactly what she was doing? I know that the video has given many people something to think about and debate.

This man acted in a lawful manner with the same amount of respect that he was given. I, personally, don't see anything wrong with his actions. What matters most, though, is that it is now a subject for conversation and people are thinking about it. If enough people are outraged, on either side of this disctussion, the next step would be to DO something instead of just talking about it. What could be better for our country than people taking a stand and ACTING on their beliefs instead of just bitching and whining? Whatever the beliefs, people need to get off of their asses and do something. Nothing will ever change if all we do is piss and moan.

Is that a bit more clear?

You stole the words right out of my mouth, Chris.

[TitsMcGee]

Not quite. What I'm saying is that people who disagree with WHY he did what he did aren't standing up for what this country was founded on. Whether he went about it in a way that was palatable to you or not, he stood up for his rights. A wise man (I forget which one) once said, "Do what you can, with what you have, at the moment." To me, this says to to do the best you can every moment of every day. When tyranny encroaches on the free people of this nation, we free people are responsible for resisting said tyranny every day in every way possible. This man was not being any more rude than the border patrol agent was. This man was practicing civil disobedience, nothing more. I know that acting in such a manner to the bottom of the totem pole, so to speak, will not accomplish much at that moment except for a traffic jam. Yet he made a statement. What are the chances that that particular border patrol agent went home thinking about exactly what she was doing? I know that the video has given many people something to think about and debate.

This man acted in a lawful manner with the same amount of respect that he was given. I, personally, don't see anything wrong with his actions. What matters most, though, is that it is now a subject for conversation and people are thinking about it. If enough people are outraged, on either side of this disctussion, the next step would be to DO something instead of just talking about it. What could be better for our country than people taking a stand and ACTING on their beliefs instead of just bitching and whining? Whatever the beliefs, people need to get off of their asses and do something. Nothing will ever change if all we do is piss and moan.

Is that a bit more clear?

I'm just in no mood to debate anymore...

[Rev.Reverence]

I'm just in no mood to debate anymore...

...this was a debate?

[Mean Salley]

Where did you read that he was a female native american?

All Mexicans are Native Americans, Anyone who's origin is from North, Central, or South America, from Alaska to Argentina is a Native American. Mayan, Incan, Taino descent= Native American. Inuit, Alyuet, Tlingit = Native American. Anyone from South and Central American countries such as Chile, Nicaragua, Honduras, Paraguay, Brazil, Puerto Rico, who trace lineage to the indigenous people of said regions are also Native Americans.

This of course is why there is such a disagreement about keeping Native Americans out of Native America IE: Immigration policies.

Yeah this is off the original topic a bit, but I thought I'd help to inform people about what "Native American" encompasses.

As for the bloke in the video, he could have just answered the question and made things easier, but occasionally, it's good to keep people in check.

[Nightgaunt]

...this was a debate?

[TitsMcGee]

...this was a debate?

Excuse me, let me rephrase. I am in no mood to discuss this anymore.

[Rev.Reverence]

Excuse me, let me rephrase. I am in no mood to discuss this anymore.

I am a...

s m a r t a s s...

[freydis]

Take the protest up with people who can actually do something to change it, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. I mean really trying to get that past you guys is like talking to a damn wall. Being a dick to a border agent 9 out of 10 times will just get you arrested. If you want things changed used your right to protest just protest the right people.

These are the same people methinks that basically yell and scream and abuse representatives of companies they are mad at, because they feel wronged. I can't get any more specific, for legal reasons, but a few people here will know what i am talking about.

Dont abuse the person doing their job. Dont like what theyre doing? Take it up with whoever is in charge. Chances are, the person youre being nasty to cant give you hat you want anyway, be it information, an answer, or any other sort of satisfaction.

It's not about respect for authority.

It's about being a decent, polite human being.

[freydis]

I'm comparing our current situation with Canada and Australia and trying to see the "bad" in this statement.

[freydis]

I still say there would have been a better way to do it.

And I think some of the rhetoric being brandished like a cheap rapier in this topic would be better put to use elsewhere.

Like in a topic about serious abuses of power..... this is kinda silly. Come to find out, doing a little digging.... the border patrol is at this particular area because of ferry traffic. So.... theyre more concerned about people coming in off the water.

The waterways and scarcely populated coastlines of the Olympic Peninsula have been used for decades by smugglers trafficking in everything from Prohibition-era booze to potent British Columbia marijuana.

Apparently, theyve made 16 arrests. They havent been there very long, either.

Theyre doing their job.